Mike Griswold, VP Analyst with Gartner, is back with our popular “Supply Chain Today and Tomorrow” series. Mike joins Scott and Greg monthly to share new developments across the world of global supply chain, and weighs in with his take.

In this episode, we are bringing back one of Mike’s favorite themes, Hollywood week! Listen in as Mike shares a few of his favorite movie quotes that can be associated with key trends in what we’re seeing in global supply chain, and a lot more.

Intro/Outro (00:03):

Welcome to Supply Chain. Now the voice of global supply chain supply chain now focuses on the best in the business for our worldwide audience, the people, the technologies, the best practices, and today’s critical issues, the challenges and opportunities. Stay tuned to hear from Those Making Global Business happen right here on supply chain now.

Scott Luton (00:33):

Hey, good morning, good afternoon, good evening, wherever you are, Scott Luton and Gregory White here with you on Supply Chain. Now welcome to today’s live stream. Hey Greg. How you doing today?

Greg White (00:44):

Doing quite well.

Scott Luton (00:45):

Yeah.

Greg White (00:46):

Using the name that my mother gave me, I think her quote was, she thought it would sound good. And then I b m boardroom <laugh>, b m Boardroom Once, and they did not call me Gregory <laugh>.

Scott Luton (00:59):

I watched a Seinfeld episode last night where George is dating a very formal individual and she calls Jerry Seinfeld, Jerome. And it’s really funny just throughout the show. So anyway, Greg back, uh, popular demand. We have got, we’re continuing a long running series, long running popular series supply chain today and tomorrow with Mike Griswold from Gartner. And we are going to be talking about some critical must not miss developments across global supply chain today and time, and two movies probably from the seventies, eighties, nineties, and two thousands. I bet. What do you think, Greg? Yeah,

Greg White (01:42):

I doubt, I doubt I’ll reach back for the

Scott Luton (01:44):

Forties. <laugh>? No. All right. Maybe not. Maybe not. But that folks, we got a great show. Well, there

Greg White (01:51):

Is, uh, when it, what is it’s a Beautiful Life. Is that It’s a wonderful Life. Is that thirties? 1938, correct.

Scott Luton (01:58):

I think you’re right. Without looking

Greg White (02:00):

Maybes the thirties, because there are some, there are some supply day happenings that could make you wanna jump off the

Scott Luton (02:05):

Bridge <laugh>.

Greg White (02:07):

Unless you’ve never been born,

Scott Luton (02:08):

Unfortunately. You’re right. Little Shop of horrors. Little updated references. Groundhog Day. Oh, I’ve got ’em all teed up right over here. Greg <laugh>. Alright folks, we wanna hear from you though. So we’re about to have Mike join us. We’re gonna walk through three supply chain trends. We’re gonna really bake in a lot of probably movie references. And folks, let us know what you’re thinking. Let us know some of your trends you’re identifying in some of those movies. Like Andre, Greg is back with us holding down the fork. Yeah,

Greg White (02:38):

Blake came back, please. Andre.

Scott Luton (02:40):

And of course Lee

Greg White (02:42):

Watching

Scott Luton (02:43):

<laugh>. That’s right. Lee Lutton with uh, the pride of Aiken, South Carolina. Great to see you mom, as always. Alright, so Greg, before we bring on Mike Griswold with Gardner, let’s do this. Let’s share a couple resources on the front end here. ’cause folks, y’all know we’re on a, on a mission to help make your lives, your jobs, your organizations, your supply chains easier. One of those ways is you can check out our weekly, almost weekly newsletter. We skip, I think Labor Day weekend. We, our team’s gotta take some of those holidays off too. So our, almost weekly, with that said LinkedIn newsletter and here, Greg, we talked about a variety of ways you can really support the veteran community, whether they’re in transition or they’re already out in the business world. Your quick thought there, Greg.

Greg White (03:28):

Yeah, very cool. We talked about that Monday had significant depth, but yeah, that’s a difficult transition. So I think anything that business people could do to give vets the perspective on how raus and how much less organized or structured I guess we are in, in civilian business, it’s hugely helpful.

Scott Luton (03:49):

Hmm. Raus. That’s a great word. Greg

Greg White (03:52):

Raus, right. Thank

Scott Luton (03:52):

You for expanding my vocabulary for about five ongoing five years now. I appreciate that <laugh>. All right. Also, speaking of resources, and by the way folks, our webinars are free to attend. You just gotta register tomorrow. We’re hosting Paul and James Paul’s with Trace Gaines. We’re talking about five steps to getting proactive with digitization. I always trip up on that word, digitization and supply chain data at 12 noon Eastern time. Join me and Greg for that. Greg quick blurb there. Be there. Be Square.

Greg White (04:25):

Yeah, I mean, what do we talk about all the time? Digital transformation, digitization, democratization,

Scott Luton (04:32):

All of the Asians.

Greg White (04:34):

And, but, but I mean the world is ever more connected and never more connected than what it’s in supply chain. So,

Scott Luton (04:41):

So true. All the Asians, I love that

Greg White (04:44):

Be the nineties <laugh>.

Scott Luton (04:46):

And folks, we drop links there so you can check out the newsletter we mentioned and the webinar, your one click away. We try to make things easy. Easy is good. Okay, everybody. So, uh, little note here, Catherine and big thanks to Catherine, Amanda behind the scenes. 1946 is when it’s a Wonderful Life was released.

Greg White (05:04):

Oh wow. Okay. So after the

Scott Luton (05:07):

War I,

Greg White (05:08):

Yeah, why? I wonder what I’m thinking of those 30. Oh, gone with Wind.

Scott Luton (05:14):

That’s it. One

Greg White (05:14):

Other one of big classics. Yeah.

Scott Luton (05:17):

Alright, so stay tuned folks. Stay tuned. We’re gonna have a lot of fun. It’s gonna be informative, entertaining, and educational here today, as always is. So with no further ado, Greg, I wanna bring in our featured guest once again. Mike Griswold, vice President Analyst with Gartner. Hey. Hey Mike. How you doing?

Mike Griswold (05:33):

Hey. Hey. I’m doing well. Thanks. How’s everybody doing?

Scott Luton (05:35):

Doing wonderful. I just learned that I cannot sneak a drink. The swoosh is not long enough to sneak a drink. I gotta get better

Greg White (05:42):

Online patent. Tried to do that. <laugh> you on actual televis joke. Right,

Scott Luton (05:47):

Right, right. All right, so Greg and Mike, man, we got a lot to get through here today, but I wanna start as we always do a little fun warmup question and we’re gonna celebrate what I bet bet is a very popular day here in the States. It’s National Taco Day here in the us which is kind of weird to me because you would assume, I guess I would assume that it would be a fall, a Tuesday. But interestingly enough, taco Tuesday phrase was actually trademarked here in the States back in 1989 by a place called Taco John’s up in where everyone thinks of when they think of tacos, Wyoming. So that, I guess that was a thing. So I’m gonna ask Greg and Mike here light one of life’s burning questions. What is your go-to when it comes to getting the best tacos on the planet, or at least in your neck of the woods? So Mike, let’s start with you.

Mike Griswold (06:38):

Yeah, so not a big taco fan, believe it or not. We have a very good taco kind of area around me, but I’m not a big taco person. You know, if, if we want tacos, I actually prefer my wife makes some really good fish tacos.

Scott Luton (06:53):

Okay.

Mike Griswold (06:54):

So I’ll just head downstairs from my office and we’ll have fish tacos. So yeah,

Scott Luton (07:00):

love that. All convenient. You’re saying you’re vertically integrated, is what you’re saying, Mike?

Mike Griswold (07:04):

Yes.

Scott Luton (07:04):

Is that right? Yes. <laugh>. Alright, Greg, I think, you know what? No, you always surprise me. I know we have a couple places that we love here in the metro Atlantic area, but what is your go-to Greg?

Greg White (07:15):

Well, my favorite is Mexico City. I mean, if you want good, what we now, now call in the state street tacos. They just call it tacos. You could get on the street. Mexico City is great for that, but Taco Vo has to be number one. It’s num, it’s one of the top five taco joints in America. And it’s also being that it’s from my house, so.

Scott Luton (07:40):

Wow,

Greg White (07:41):

That’s not a bad thing. Used to be served outdoors like it should be dumpy little shack where you’re probably safer outdoors than indoors. But now they’ve moved into a big old restaurant and brought the picnic tables from outside in and so you can eat their radio, Sean, which is nice. And the place is just packed.

Scott Luton (08:05):

Okay, that sounds delicious. Sounds delicious. Both do. I would add, Amanda’s telling me that Taco John’s a place at trademark, trademark name. It’s big in the Midwest, Iowa and Nebraska at least. So lots of tacos there.

Greg White (08:18):

I thought I was wondering if it was a chain, because I’ve actually eaten that Taco John’s. Okay.

Scott Luton (08:24):

It’s new to me.

Greg White (08:25):

I’m gladly trademarked. Taco Tuesday, he talk trademark. Great topics.

Scott Luton (08:31):

Right. And I’ll just throw one more. So Mike says, stays home. Greg shared his favorite Nuevo Laredo here in off Chattahoochee Avenue, if I’m not mistaken, Greg. Yep. Crossing the Pepsi plant in metro Atlanta is one of the places to go here in the a t l. Alright, so we’ve got a lot to get to here today, now that we’re all starving, we’re bringing, bringing back one of Mike’s <laugh>, one of Mike’s and all of ours. Really our favorite themes Hollywood week. So as we were talking pre-show, we’re gonna get Mike to share three key trends in global supply chain that can be associated with movies, TV shows, you name it. Kinda like, um, with the ongoing freight market challenges, maybe we weave in the Stephen King Classic from the nineties, misery, who knows? Stuff like that. We have a little fun and inform at the same time. So that does not get Greg’s approval. I could tell with the shaking your head, Greg. All right. So, uh, Mike, where are we starting with our first trend of the day?

Mike Griswold (09:34):

So I wanna, before we do that, I wanna go back real quick. Okay. To your veteran announcement, right? Mm-hmm. In, in the beginning of this, I don’t have any quotes from the movie, but, and I think most people who joined us over the months know a big military history person 30 years ago yesterday. And today was the Battle of Mogadishu Black Hawk down. Mm-hmm. If you get a chance to see the movie we

Scott Luton (09:57):

A year ago, wow. 30

Mike Griswold (09:59):

Years. Hard to believe, isn’t it? But if you people out there, if you get a chance, see the movie, read the book, the book is better as it almost always is. Mm-hmm.

Scott Luton (10:07):

But

Mike Griswold (10:07):

It’s pretty significant event in the course of American military history.

Scott Luton (10:11):

Yeah. So

Mike Griswold (10:12):

With, with that outta the way, let’s start with this idea that we talk a lot about here around agility and resilience. Mm-hmm. And to some degree adaptability. And what I have is, I have three movies and three quotes. The first is from Jaws, obviously we’re gonna need a bigger

Scott Luton (10:29):

Boat, right? That,

Mike Griswold (10:30):

That talks about kind of getting in the middle of the ocean and having no plan A or plan B. The other thing as a quick side note, which I wanna get to see, I don’t know if anyone in our audience has seen it. Okay. I came across, there was a Broadway play that is about the, the making of Jaws. It’s got three characters.

Mike Griswold (10:53):

Robert Shaw’s son plays Robert Shaw in this play. Robert Shaw, the quick character. And, and the, the premise of the play is during the filming of this, when they’re out in the ocean, Bruce, the mechanical shark breaks down and it breaks down for hours. So this play is about the three of them passing time while someone tries to fix the shark. I guess they didn’t get along kind of Offscreen. I don’t think Robert Shaw cared very much for Richard Dreyfus, which I get. I don’t like him Much either, <laugh>. But anyway, so as a side note, if anyone has seen that, let me know. ’cause I’d love, I I’ve seen snippets on YouTube, it looks fantastic. But anyway, we’re gonna need a bigger boat.

Scott Luton (11:36):

Hey Mike, I gotta throw something in and Greg and I have seen this before. We had a little fun with it, uh, a month or two ago. There is a a, a neat shot and it must be from when the big mechanical shark breaks Down because Robert Shaw is on the back of the, the prop boat and he’s either reading a book, he’s Got his legs crossed, he’s really relaxed and right beside him is this massive mechanical shark <laugh>. And it’s just a great little scene. I don’t have to go back and dig that out. But like Greg, I think we messed around and added your infamous hashtag startup life to that scene, Greg, right. Finding peace where no matter what’s going on around, is that right, Greg? That’s right.

Greg White (12:12):

You know what’s, what else I’d discover is the reason that the big great white shark in Finding Nemo is named Bruce is probably because.

Mike Griswold (12:21):

Yes,

Greg White (12:22):

Bruce The mechanical shark. I just thought about that.

Mike Griswold (12:25):

Yes.

Scott Luton (12:26):

Okay. I’m just having a eureka moment and epiphany.

Greg White (12:29):

That was, that was some great movie inside for somebody to do that. <laugh>.

Mike Griswold (12:33):

Alright. It looks like Catherine has found the show. The shark is broken. So Catherine, thank you very much. Again, if anyone has seen it, uh, I’d love to hear it. It looks fantastic. So that one’s kind of a no-brainer. The second one from Top Gun, I feel the need for speed, right? Everyone’s talking about how do we get our supply chains faster. And then the last one from the Wizard of Oz, we’re not in Kansas anymore. And I think the reason that resonated with me is our supply chains are now so much different. They don’t look anything like they used to look even before the pandemic supply chains were starting to evolve. So when I think about this idea of agil agility and resilience, those three things came to.

Scott Luton (13:16):

Okay. So let’s pause there for a second. So the first trend is that agility and resilience. And, and Mike’s already dropped a lot of different references there, Greg, Respond To that. What comes to your mind when you think of some of those themes and movies that might lay out there?

Greg White (13:32):

Y yeah. Well, I mean, agility and resilience is what supply chain is about. I’ve always contended that it is not a cost saving exercise regardless of the way that we mentioned from the beginning of time. But it is instead a risk balancing exercise. It is trying to preempt problems as much as you can and responding as quickly as you possibly can when you cannot. I always often quote my on this whole notion of rewarding the arsonist, right?

Greg White (14:02):

Where the culture of supply chain has become to kind of ignore all of the possible faults, flaws, ilities in a supply chain, and then reward ourselves for letting it collapse and then stacking it back together. So I think that one of the things we have to acknowledge is that we have to predict and preempt these fragilities, and that’s what resiliency really is. Mm. So can I give you a movie reference, please? It’s not particular these trends, but this is, um, sort of a symptom of supply chain. So my movie reference is Titanic, which is and under, under engineered technology operated with hubris and carelessness in, uh, threatening waters dangerous waters, which we often do in supply chain.

Scott Luton (14:53):

Mm, that’s an excellent point.

Mike Griswold (14:55):

I mean, I, I, I think Greg, that’s a great example because if you think about the, the other message I I think about when I think about Titanic is the kind of the conflict of goals, right? Because you have the white line, or the white star line says, we need to get from point A to point B as fast as we can,

Greg White (15:16):

Right?

Mike Griswold (15:17):

Don’t really care, you know, what’s in the water, right? The cap, the captain is trying to say, oh, he doesn’t do a very good job of it. Obviously the captain is trying to say, well, wait a minute, there’s some risk here. We need to slow down. We need to think about a different course. So you’ve got these conflicting goals, which everyone deals with in real life, right? You know, one person, one part of the business wants this, another part of the business wants that. That’s a great example, Greg, Titanic of those conflicting goals. And what can happen if you don’t find a way to work that out. Obviously for many organizations it’s not as bad as hitting an iceberg in the Titanic, but it could be. Mm-hmm. Right? If, if you don’t figure out how to navigate that,

Greg White (16:00):

It’s the risk of losing the entirety of your Carving.

Scott Luton (16:04):

Mm-hmm. Yes. Excellent point. All right. So before we move on to the second trend, I think I can share this graphic thanks to Catherine because we, I wanna go back to the play. I think it’s A play. This Is The Shark is broken.

Mike Griswold (16:19):

Yes.

Scott Luton (16:20):

I believe right Mike?

Mike Griswold (16:21):

Yes. That is it. All right. That is it, Catherine. Thank you so much.

Scott Luton (16:26):

Ian Shaw, I guess is Robert Shaw’s Son and I guess His partner there, Joseph Nixon. So y’all check that out. And, uh, Five star reviews from the Times Sunday Mirror, the Telegraph, you name it. So we’ll have to check that out there.

Mike Griswold (16:40):

There’s snippets. I’d YouTube, and again, I’ll date myself if anyone has seen Robert Shaw in Jaws or The Deep or the Guns in Navarone, his son looks and sounds mm-hmm. Exactly like him. It’s Unbelievable. I guess you would expect that from a sibling, uh, or a child. But yeah, it’s uncanny how much he looks and sounds like his dad.

Scott Luton (17:03):

Mm.

Greg White (17:03):

I wonder if he can sing Farewell on the do as well As Robert Shaw can because that’s one of my favorite songs.

Scott Luton (17:09):

Which one was that? Greg Farewell

Greg White (17:12):

The Dew to You. Oh, remember when he that as the

Mike Griswold (17:17):

Yes.

Greg White (17:17):

Before They get hit by the Shark

Mike Griswold (17:19):

Also. Yes,

Scott Luton (17:21):

Greg. That is a great call out man. You don’t miss A thing.

Greg White (17:24):

Never.

Scott Luton (17:24):

Andre says, I think resilience shines through in the movie The Revenant. Now I’m not sure if I’ve seen that movie. Have y’all seen Greg? My, I

Mike Griswold (17:33):

I have not.

Greg White (17:35):

It’s about some guy up in some godforsaken cold wasteland.

Mike Griswold (17:39):

Yes.

Greg White (17:40):

Looking for somebody. I don’t remember her being looked for. I don’t remember.

Scott Luton (17:44):

Alright. I think

Mike Griswold (17:46):

Rio and Amanda reminds us.

Scott Luton (17:48):

Okay, so Tom Hardy and Leonardo di Cap DiCaprio. Okay, I’ll check that out. Alright, so let’s see here. Mom. Lee Luton says No shark movie since Jaws has been so scary. The music itself was scary.

Greg White (18:03):

I wouldn’t do it. So we lived in Springfield, Missouri at the time, and I wouldn’t even go in the lake. We went fishing every Weekend and ski.

Mike Griswold (18:11):

Yes.

Greg White (18:12):

Lake of the Ozarks and Lake or Table Rock Lake. And I would not go in the lake for weeks after that.

Mike Griswold (18:17):

Yes,

Scott Luton (18:18):

I’m with you. I gotta be able to see my toes. All right. So that’s just the first trend. So I think, and I’m gonna circle back to some of these other comments here in a second, but let’s move to trend Number two, Mike.

Mike Griswold (18:28):

Yeah. Trend number two, I think we’ve talked about this as well on this show, is, is a redefinition that is happening around how people think about their supply chains. And I, and the movies that come to mind for me. And I actually have four. ’cause something that Greg said triggered another thought. So I’ve got four. The first is, and we joked with Catherine, she’s gonna have to look all these up. So, cool hand Luke,

Scott Luton (18:57):

Like what

Mike Griswold (18:57):

We have here is a failure to communicate you

Greg White (18:59):

Really. And

Mike Griswold (19:00):

I think under understanding what we want our supply chains to do and the supply chains communicating what they can do, I think is huge. Casablanca, what we have here is the beginning of a beautiful friendship, right? I think more and more organizations are starting to see the value that their supply chain can bring, right? And so what popped into my head, Greg, when you were talking, when I think about value is, uh, Jerry McGuire showed me the money, right? Mm-hmm. Supply chains are now being asked to, to help, uh, CEOs with things like revenue growth entry in new market. Yeah. Show me the money. And then with having six grandkids, I get exposed to a lot of kids movies. My favorite line from the Olivia Bugs life is the number one rule of leadership. Everything is your fault, <laugh>. And people raise their hands, right? And say, how many times have you heard it’s all the supply chain’s fault, right? So we need to start to figure out how do we change that narrative a little bit. But those were the four movies that came to mind when I think about how people are redefining their supply chain.

Scott Luton (20:03):

I love that. All right, two quick thoughts. I’m gonna come to you, Greg. First off, I’ve heard that Bug’s Life quote from Greg, countless times Over Our friendship one And Number two, our dear friend Jenny Frum’s with us, Greg singing, I’m so glad I checked in. She says, Jenny, we love you. Great to have you.

Greg White (20:20):

<laugh>. <laugh>.

Scott Luton (20:22):

Alright. So Greg Redefinition and, and of course Mike just dropped some Serious Content on us there.

Greg White (20:27):

Yeah, I don’t know what movie this is, I’m not sure what movie to tie it to, but maybe it’s one with Nicole Kidman. What has been seen cannot be unseen, right? Mm-hmm. And that’s, that’s the thing that I think has re really redefined the supply chain. I think for all of of our coveting about wanting more credibility, a seat at the table and that sort of thing, we didn’t really know what that meant. And after what I’m gonna talk about, Scott, the great toilet paper shortage of 2020, everyone knows what a supply chain is. Everyone knows what it does. And everyone knows that at some level, everyone is at fault. If a supply chain fails, it’s not just Target Costco’s fault. It’s not just the retail facing entities for retail goods, it’s everyone. Right? It’s charman, it’s the paper providers, it’s the, um, pul processors, whatever. So I, I think that is a really and very important thing we keep saying, and I will disagree till the day that I don’t, we keep saying that supply chains are more disruptive, whatever than they’ve ever been. It’s absolutely untrue.

Greg White (21:38):

Don’t believe that one bit. It’s just that nobody gave a before because nobody knew what supply chain was or did. And, and to Mike’s point, it was the supply chain failed. Mike, it’s your fault. End of discussion. Not what could we do about it? Not what did we do to crack the ilities that we knew existed in the supply chain. Right? What unreasonable demand we put on the supply chain, or lack of preparation, preparation we had in the supply chain. It was just, was just, it failed end of discussion. So now that it’s been seen, I think consumers, we, consumers, we’ve forced companies to examine their supply chain more thoroughly. And why, because there’s nowhere to hide and more is at state when delivering goods here, your brand equity is at stake. Think about how many companies during just after the, the, um, pandemic went down the tubes because they couldn’t deliver, right? I mean, Peloton, Peloton exploded with demand, right? So they shipped everything at an unsustainable cost and crossed the account.

Scott Luton (22:48):

Hmm.

Greg White (22:49):

Right? I mean, those are discussions that literally my guys like Mike and I have been having for decades is sure we can get it here faster and sure we can give you a hundred percent bill rate, but it’s going to cost more than the company can afford. So I think that visibility of the entire world to supply chain is the thing that, that has impacted it the most.

Scott Luton (23:12):

All right, Mike?

Mike Griswold (23:13):

Yeah. I couldn’t agree more, Greg. I, I think the, the part that you said around getting a seat at the table, I think what resonates the most with me when we talk to clients, one of the things we we try to do is when we give them advice, it’s what are you signing up for if you wanna take advantage of this advice? And I think one of the things we as supply chain professionals is Greg said very well, we always wanted a seat at the table, but I don’t think we ever really knew what that meant. And we didn’t know what we were signing up for when we decided to get a seat at the big people’s table. And now that we have it, it’s how do we keep it and how do we not get relegated To the

Mike Griswold (23:55):

Perception that people had of us pre pandemic? ’cause if I look at some of our research data, what we’re seeing is in less performing companies, the supply chain is now starting to get moved out of that seat at the table. High performing companies recognize what they have with a really good supply chain, and they’re keeping that seat at the table. So my advice to people, our advice to people when, when they talk to us and we talk to them, is you need to continue to demonstrate relevance. You need to continue to show the business, this is why we’re here and this is the value that we can create. And if you don’t do that right, and this is a, I guess a soccer reference, I don’t know what it means, you’re gonna get relegated. And I’ve, I’m assuming it’s a bad thing in soccer to get relegated. It’s, we know it’s a bad thing to get relegated in the supply chain.

Scott Luton (24:50):

Mm-hmm. So to our non soccer fans, perhaps if you watch baseball, getting relegated is kind of like getting pushed down from the major leagues to AAA or AA because of your performance. Correct.

Greg White (25:02):

Not one player, the entire franchise.

Scott Luton (25:05):

Right. Good point.

Greg White (25:05):

You feel like, right, that would be like the Yankees getting moved to aaa, which this season is <laugh> that might happen.

Scott Luton (25:13):

Probably should happened, right? All right, man, y’all share a ton there. I just wanna add just two quick things. Cool. Hand Luke, one of my all time favorites. So many good scenes from that. But when he tries to eat those, when he does eat those 50 boiled eggs, it makes me not want eggs for about three years. Um, and then secondly, yeah, Greg, you mentioned tp. It’s so interesting. I didn’t know that we had a major issue across the global toilet paper market, but if y’all seen the recent announcement, I think it’s Sharmin, I could have that wrong. They have re-engineered how each sheet is the perforation between It.

Scott Luton (25:51):

So, and from what I’ve been reading, not experimenting with, but reading. So you can pull it and tear it easily, it from any angle. I didn’t think that was an issue to spend a whole bunch of money on doing. But Greg and Mike, I’ll defer y consumers as well. Do they? Is that valuable or not valuable? Y’all, y’all thoughts?

Mike Griswold (26:12):

Yeah.

Greg White (26:13):

I’m not using toilet paper here, right? No,

Scott Luton (26:17):

the, the perforation changes.

Greg White (26:18):

Well, that’s when you use the perforation, right?

Scott Luton (26:21):

Well, right.

Mike Griswold (26:23):

I’m thinking it’s potentially solving a problem. To your point, Scott, that I didn’t know we had. ’cause it always tears just fine for me. So <laugh>, I, I didn’t know there was a a, a challenge. So in my house, as long as the, this will probably start a a, a short debate amongst everyone in, uh, in everyone’s household, as long as the toilet paper is, is coming over the top of my, oh, life is good. That’s

Greg White (26:46):

The way that happy describes it, by the way, for toilet paper world.

Scott Luton (26:52):

Oh gosh.

Greg White (26:53):

Saying that is the right way.

Scott Luton (26:56):

This brings whether it’s valuable or non valuable, this brings a whole new angle to a conversation around muda or waste. So we will leave it there.

Greg White (27:07):

And why Do I have a feeling, Scott, that these are the same people who can’t unwrap craft singles <laugh>?

Scott Luton (27:13):

That’s good. Great question. Great question. All right, so let’s share a couple things here. Andre wants us to imagine the disruption, <laugh>, when the wheel was first invented. How about that? Can you imagine how long it took to get on or catch on across the globe? Great point there. Jenny enjoys all the movie lines. A very clever Mike. Let’s see. Great to see you, Mohamed. Great to see you here. And we’ll work through each of these, the rest of the comments here as we work through this, the rest of the show. Alright, Greg and Mike, really quick blurb before we hit the third trend, Greg, again, it’s all about resources. We wanna share one more resource with our audience here Today. Coming Up on October 19th, 12 noon, where our friends from enable are joining us, again from numbers to strategy, how finance drives data-driven supply chains. Y’all Join us for that. It’s free to free to attend. You just gotta register. Greg should be another great show with our friends that enable, huh?

Greg White (28:09):

Well, you know, it’s a big part of select team that we often sleep out. Get paid, right? I mean, paying for the shipment, paying for the goods is, it’s part of the supply chain.

Scott Luton (28:22):

That’s right.

Greg White (28:23):

What makes it go.

Scott Luton (28:24):

That’s right. All right. So Mike, back to, so by my count, the first trend I can, and I can’t keep up with all the movie references, but first trend, agility, and resilience. The second one was that redefinition, which I think is a great one that’s not talked about enough. And then thirdly, what’s your third trend here today?

Mike Griswold (28:42):

So this is one where I, I might need some help from the audience and from you guys around some quotes. I, I have one. The third trend is just to focus on people, right? When I think about where we wanna go as a supply chain, right? We can have all the technology we want in the world. At the end of the day, it does come down to people, it comes down to skills, it comes down to relationships. The hottest topic that we have right now in Gartner, which will not be a surprise to anyone is generative ai. And that’s all well and good, but we still need to figure out as people, you know, how are we gonna use that? Mm-hmm. So the quote that I found, and I frankly never read the books, haven’t seen any of the movies. It’s from the Fellowship of the Rings, which basic basically said the quote is even the smallest of people can change the course of the future.

Mike Griswold (29:34):

And when I saw that quote, it really resonated with me when I, ’cause part of my team that I managed looks after supply chain talent. And when I think about how we think about our people, yeah, I think it’s very easy for us to kind of gloss over certain positions within our organizations. And I think this quote really resonated with me from the standpoint that you never know where the next great idea is gonna come from in your organizations. You never know what role or team is gonna play a critical role in the success of your supply chain, right? I mean, Greg and I have a soft spot for demand planners, right? It, it could be, uh, an individual forecaster or an individual demand planner. That is, that is demand planning for a critical skew or component within your portfolio. You just never know. And I think it’s important that organizations canvas their organizations looking for those types of up and coming, um, performance, uh, and and future leaders.

Mike Griswold (30:41):

’cause you never know where they’re gonna come from. So that was one. And then as I was thinking about when you were kind of transitioning to this section, one of my all time favorite movies, my wife and I have this debate every time it’s on TV, is Saving Private Ryan. It lost the best picture Oscar to Shakespeare Love. We have this huge debate all, every time Shakespeare Love is on, oh, it won the best Oscar. No, no, it shouldn’t have. Whatever they know <laugh>. But, but there, there there’s a line in that, in that, in Saving Private Ryan, where there’re kind of as a group trying to figure out the, the value of extending all of this energy to find one person.

Scott Luton (31:22):

Hmm.

Mike Griswold (31:23):

And there there’s an interaction where the individual members of platoon are all griping about the energy. They’re expending to find one person. And there’s this dialogue around basically how do you complain, right? Soldiers can complain up. Uh, officers never complain down mm-hmm. And I think, not that I’m talking written necessarily about complaining, but this idea of feedback, how do you give feedback? How do you give constructive feedback in an organization, I think is another element to this idea of people. And I think if you look at highly successful organizations, one of the things they figured out is how do they talk to each other relative to constructive feedback.

Scott Luton (32:06):

Hmm. Excellent point. Mike. I Tell Can be challenging. I think all of us, I know I’ve had plenty of challenges leaning into that constructive feedback. That’s one of the Best ways to get better. Greg weigh In on his third trend of that focus on the people.

Greg White (32:21):

Well, I mean, I think of it, this isn’t really movie line, but out the mouth, the bay, one of the things that I think we should relish in business generally, but supply chain definitely is this notion of the blessing of naive today of someone who doesn’t know any better saying, why don’t we do it this way? That is oh so powerful. Because I can’t tell you the number of times I have seen or heard it myself where somebody says, well, why don’t we do this? And you think, well, I’ve been doing it for 25 years the other way. I never even thought about doing that. Right? And of course we could do that. So I think that notion of enabling people regardless of what their stature, their tenure, their, you know, um, position is, is really important. Think about how many times you, I mean you might have been standing in a store or where and got a great idea from the stocking clerk or the forklift driver or Right. Or receiving clerk or Whatever, The guy who sweeps the floors, right?

Greg White (33:32):

Okay. There’s a good movie reference for you, right? Which is, I don’t want, I don’t wanna do the one I want to Do, which is, hey <laugh> bba, it’s BBA, isn’t it? Um, No, It’s the notion Of walking Through a NASA warehouse and asking the person who’s sweeping, sweeping the floor, what’s your job Here?

Greg White (33:57):

And that person says, my job is to put a man on the moon. So I think that’s everyone’s job and everyone has some insight to putting a man on the moon or products into motion or service levels to a higher level, whatever it is. So I think that’s one of the things we definitely have to do is open the door because we have so many naive people coming into the workforce. They know nothing about the workforce. And we had so many people who held all of the knowledge in their heads that we never captured, right? This, the great resignation was virtually all baby boomers.

Scott Luton (34:36):

Mm.

Greg White (34:37):

And so much of what they knew was never captured. And now we have people who know nothing literally in many cases about supply chain or even how to undertake a job because we’re introducing so many people to the workforce now. Hmm. But still there is wisdom in that naive and I think it’s important to enable the ability to capture it.

Scott Luton (35:01):

Excellent point. Excellent point. And Mike, going back to how you kind of opened it, I love that quote, and I’m not gonna get it right, but basically anybody anywhere can impact the future no matter where they are, where they work. How much experience, to your point, Greg, what they’ve done a really big believer in that. And you know what, going back to Jenny’s point, this is why conversations around d e I are so important. Yeah. And with you, you wanna bring everybody into the room to have the conversations because we all look at the problem, the opportunity a lot different just based on what our walk of life has been. So love your third one of the focus on the people. One other thing from Jenny, really quick, and I may not, we’re covering up Michael A. Little too much here. I wanna share this real, she says real <laugh>, Jenny says she got this thing from Dr. Faith Michelle might be Michelle Lee, but Michelle, this acronym Banani, B A N I, We’re living in Aban world, brittle, anxious, non-linear, incomprehensible. And she says, I’m sure it’s well known and maybe I just listened for once, but that, and Vuca, the U C a, which we’ve talked about before, pretty much makes supply chain professional jobs pretty tricky. Okay. So Mike and Greg, We, uh, are going to get, as we start to wrap here with Mike, one of my favorite questions we’ve been asking you in the last few months is one eureka moment. And you’ve probably, you’ve shared a few already, but one, what’s one eureka moment glean from your conversations, your, those kind of confidential sidebar conversations with business leaders over the last month that you think would really intrigued folks here today?

Mike Griswold (36:33):

Yeah. I think there’s just a continued emphasis on diversification of people’s manufacturing strategies. Right? I think we, we’ve talked in the past year, we have a lot of research on this idea of China plus one. Now I think people are, are trying to kind of maybe replace China with somebody else and a plus one. You know, I think the, the challenge with that and, and Greg, we, we’ve spoken this about this collectively numerous times, is there’s been so much investment in what I would call infrastructure in interacting with China that it’s very hard to just unplug that And

Mike Griswold (37:15):

Plug that in someplace else. I think people are looking and trying to explore how to do that. I think they’re looking to find, we talked a little bit about this I think last month with some of the semiconductor work that’s going on, some of the movement of facilities. But I think it’s, it really comes down to where can you do that that already has some underlying infrastructure to support you and can you get an advantage about being in some of these new markets first mm-hmm. So that you have kind of the first access to what in some of these countries is going to be a limited infrastructure in terms of how much new stuff they can support. So I think the, the, the topic that I would share is, is just the continuation around diversification and being very mindful and having a strategy around that. Right? I think there was a lot of kneejerk reaction that said, Hey, we’re going to get out of China. But again, to our earlier conversation, what does that really mean? Right? What are you signing up for if that’s your strategy? And I think there, there’s still a lot of work to be done around that diversification strategy.

Scott Luton (38:23):

Well said Mike and completely agree. That knee jerk reaction, Greg, I don’t know if you remember right when the pandemic hit the states and fully throated, right? March, 2019, I think it was right after, uh, Modex, I think if you remember Greg, we were getting reached out to some folks that right there, they’re ready to pull everything back to the states not taking into account a lot of things you just shared there, Mike, about just the sheer reality and some of the constraints and this, that and the other. But Greg react to what Mike shared there.

Greg White (38:52):

Yeah. I think we’ve seen a lot of near dooring and shoring, whatever you want to call it, brain shoring over the course of the last several years. And we talked with Enrique at Vector who does, whose business in Mexico is booming because of Right. And he, he sees a lot booming there. But it’s a very difficult proposition because China is the largest workforce on the planet by an order of magnitude.

Scott Luton (39:19):

Right?

Greg White (39:20):

Right. And additionally they are both culturally and politically compelled to be very, very thorough, hardworking, structured people. Right? I mean this is a, this, let’s think about this. This is a culture that built one of the largest IES in the world out of play. Not people out of play to honor one emperor. Mm-hmm. So I mean this is a very driven culture and you can’t duplicate that on any one place. And I would argue there are the entire continence where you can’t duplicate that. You sure can’t do it in North America.

Scott Luton (40:01):

Hmm.

Greg White (40:01):

I mean it’s certainly not for the price. It’s a very difficult proposition. And as if we haven’t had enough inflation already, just try doing, I mean U AAW is showing us every reason why people don’t wanna bring labor back to the United States. Right? Right. Yep. It’s gonna be a very, very difficult proposition. And I think that’s something that we have to look out for is, I don’t know the way, it’s not to say that I haven’t heard the way, but this is where we could use some of that, that blessing of naivete is, hey, what if we did X? Yeah. Because a lot of what we’ve talked about is automation, but guess where 95% of all of the materials that are required for automation come from? Well it’s a catch 22, but we have to put some really good heads around that to figure out how to tackle that. But we can’t do it. I think to Mike, to your point, it has to be a series of moderations, not a series of pendulum games. Right. Yeah.

Scott Luton (41:10):

Alright, more to come. I wish we had a couple more hours with the two of y’all and of course all the folks in the cheap seats. But Mike, before we let you go, let’s make sure you tell us what’s coming up next at Gartner.

Mike Griswold (41:22):

Yeah. Two, two big events for anyone that is watching or going to watch, if you’re interested in planning in any level, we have two planning summits. One the end of this month in London, one the end of the month in November in Phoenix. I’ll actually be there if people wanna come up and say hi and get together, just let me know. Um, but if it’s all things planning, whether you own a planning team or whether you are a demand planner, whether you’re a technology person with systems questions or even a sponsor, potential sponsor who sells planning solutions, it’s, we launched this just before the pandemic. We had a planning summit in Denver. It was wildly successful. Pandemic hit, we, we shut all that stuff down. So we’ve restarted them this year. Attendance is already ahead of schedule in both events. So anyone that’s interested, you know, please consider joining us in, uh, in October in London. Can’t guarantee the weather there. November in Phoenix. There’s probably not too many places better than being in Phoenix in November.

Scott Luton (42:27):

Alright. And to that end, if folks want to check out information on those events or if they want to connect with you the one only, Mike Griswold, how can folks connect with you? Mike,

Mike Griswold (42:37):

LinkedIn or just send me an email, mike dot griswold@garner.com. Enjoy the conversations.

Scott Luton (42:42):

It is just that easy. Alright, so Greg, one of our favorite guests long running series. Very popular series. We got a lot of feedback on, we just wrapped the latest episode. Mike, thank you for your time. Really enjoyed you and Greg’s banner each month on the first Wednesday of each month at 12 in the eastern time. Greg, another great episode before we let Mike go, huh? Yeah, I love it. I mean, you know, someone who’s been there, done that, Mike and, and who’s still so tapped into so many of the people doing the doodling every single day. So that I live for that eureka moment at the end of these episodes, man. Thank you. Bringing well said. Uh, usually the smartest person in the room. Mike Griswold, vice president analyst with Gardner, Mike, always a pleasure. We will talk with you soon.

Mike Griswold (43:29):

Sounds good. Thanks everyone. Bye-bye.

Scott Luton (43:31):

Alright, Greg, thank production Catherine and Amanda. They gotta be quick on the swoosh there ’cause when Mike’s done, he is out, right? He’s got a busy schedule. So we’ve, it’s been neat to have him on once a month for what we’ve been three and a half years now. Is it that long? Wow. Sounds about right. But I’m with you Jenny. I should have shared this before. Mike, Mike r Griswold, you always bring such great insights to show. I agree. Uh, getting him and Greg together. Outstanding. Andre says 300 million people working nine to 10 hours a day. Very hard to beat China. Good point there. And uh, also don’t forget folks, we dropped in the links. You’re one click away from checking out the webinars, newsletters. We try to make it easy. Alright, before we wrap, Greg, I wanna circle back on one point around, what was it? A naivete? I said it right. Naivete close. It’s good to have that naivete in meetings. I just wish that they haven’t cornered a market naivete in Washington DC Right. We need doses not en mass. Would you agree, Greg?

Greg White (44:35):

Yeah. It’s not, not edited in, in DC <laugh>. It’s cognitive dissonance and

Scott Luton (44:41):

Yeah,

Greg White (44:41):

That’s what it is. So they know what they’re doing.

Scott Luton (44:45):

Okay. All, all right. So Greg, before we wrap, we’ve covered a lot of ground here today. I had some fun doing it while talking about some really serious

Greg White (44:53):

Meaty

Scott Luton (44:53):

Supply chain topics. You name it. What was one thing that you wanna point out, Greg, that out of everything we talked about or what Greg, what Mike shared, you name it, what’s one thing you think folks should take away from this conversation? I

Greg White (45:06):

Think it’s that resiliency and agility is the business of supply chain. It is the business of assuring, preempting and assuring that your goods, that your brand promise, that your brand equity and identity get to market in the means in which you desire. And that you, to whatever extent you can predict and preempt the problems, you can see some coming or at least the outcomes of problems that could hit you. And, and you res respond and recover quickly.

Scott Luton (45:41):

Mm.

Greg White (45:42):

’cause all that’s at stake is your entire business,

Scott Luton (45:45):

<laugh>. That’s alls at stake. Love that Greg and enjoyed your, the Titanic reference on the front end. That was one of my favorite ones. ’cause you know, it’s dangerous to be building and engineering with hubris. I said that word. Right? Right. All right, one other point I wanna call out. So Jessica Pinto’s a a dear friend, she joined me on the show a year or so ago. Folks, Jessica loves teaching and that passion came out by the truckload when she joined us. So Jessica, great to have you here and thanks for your comment here. Interesting insights on the talent landscape, the multi-generational workforce and the banty acronym. I agree, Jessica and, uh, may we all have the good fortune of learning from folks that love to teach her and good at it. Jessica, Greg, do you remember one of your favorite passionate and talented teachers? What’s, what’s the first teacher that comes to mind when you think of someone that you had just loved to learn from? Holly

Greg White (46:37):

Welsh. My English teacher in ninth grade.

Scott Luton (46:40):

Yeah. Love that.

Greg White (46:42):

She used to say things, first of all, she was a great teacher, just an exceptional teacher. And she used to say things like, when you would do something stupid trying to be cool in class, she would say things like, how embarrassing for you.

Scott Luton (46:56):

Oh man, I’m at, to use that one right at the parenting realm. We’ll see. Right,

Greg White (47:02):

Right. Interesting for you.

Scott Luton (47:04):

Polly Welsh. Polly Welsh, is that right? Yeah.

Greg White (47:08):

Poly Welch. Yeah.

Scott Luton (47:09):

Awesome. Love that.

Greg White (47:11):

Didn’t allow, didn’t allow you to chew gum in class, which was a problem in the eighties these days. <laugh>

Scott Luton (47:18):

Cell phone, the

Greg White (47:19):

Desk at the teacher, pull in class,

Scott Luton (47:22):

Man. And I’ll just counter that with Gloria Marks. I’ve talked about her today. I, I was fortunate to have tons of wonderful, wonderful teachers, but Gloria Marks, she was a master at storytelling and it really sticks out from third grade English to this day. Alright folks, hopefully enjoyed this wide ranging episode as much as Greg and I have. Mike always brings it and then Greg always brings it. So made for quite the last hour. You always bring on for us, we try Hollywood Week for this month’s edition of Supply Chain today and tomorrow with Mike Griswold from Gartner. So folks, whatever you do, hey, take a nugget because there was lots of practical nuggets that Greg and Mike shared here and including folks in the comments. Take a nugget, put, put it in action. Deeds, not words. That’s the name of the game. On behalf of our entire team here at Supply Chain now, Scott Lu challenging you to do good, to give forward and to be the change. We’ll see you next time, right back here at Supply Chain now. Thanks for bye.

Intro/Outro (48:17):

Thanks for being a part of our supply chain now community. Check out all of our programming@supplychainnow.com and make sure you subscribe to Supply Chain now, anywhere you listen to podcasts. And follow us on Facebook, LinkedIn, Twitter, and Instagram. See you next time on Supply Chain. Now.