Len DeCandia has enjoyed an illustrious career as a supply chain executive and chief procurement officer at some of the world’s largest CPG enterprises, including Johnson & Johnson. So who better to reflect on the changing role of procurement with Scott and Kelly than Len? In this episode, tune in to hear Len share his thoughts on how the role of procurement has evolved, the supreme importance of managing risk, delivering on the promise of ESG, challenges moving forward and more.

Intro/Outro (00:03):

Welcome to Supply Chain. Now the voice of global supply chain supply chain now focuses on the best in the business for our worldwide audience, the people, the technologies, the best practices, and today’s critical issues, the challenges and opportunities. Stay tuned to hear from those Making Global Business happen right here on supply chain now.

Scott Luton (00:31):

Hey, good morning everybody. Scott Luton and Kelly Barner here with you on Supply Chain. Now welcome to today’s show, Kelly, how you doing?

Kelly Barner (00:38):

I am doing great, Scott. Thank you so much for having me.

Scott Luton (00:41):

Well, we are delighted to have you here on Supply Chain. Now, we are also delighted to have a big show teed up and big guest here, top industry executive that I’d call quite a procurement guru, a supply chain guru, a global business guru. And he’s done big things in that space, and as you and I both know, he’s one heck of an interesting interview, Right? So, uh, as our pre-show sessions have shown, try to say that three times fast. So, Kelly, are you ready for this one?

Kelly Barner (01:06):

I am really looking forward to this one.

Scott Luton (01:09):

Well, then, with no further ado, must walk him in our featured guest here today, Lynn, to Candidia, recently retired chief Procure officer of Johnson Johnson. Lynn, how you doing?

Len DeCandia (01:18):

I’m good, Scott. Hi Kelly. How are you both?

Kelly Barner (01:22):

Hi, Lynn.

Scott Luton (01:23):

We have really enjoyed, uh, we had a, uh, I think we had a bonus extra long pre-show because we were enjoying some of your stories both professionally and personally, So we’re gonna touch on some of that here today. But great to have you, Lynn,

Len DeCandia (01:37):

So Kelly, for giving me this opportunity to share with you.

Scott Luton (01:39):

Oh, you bet. And Lynn, I even wear it a non plaided shirt for Kelly Barner who reminds me how many plaid shirts I got. <laugh>. Just kidding. Just kidding. Kelly. All right, so let’s, let’s get to know Lynn better. First, as I mentioned, uh, to all of our listeners out there, we’ve really enjoyed, uh, the pre-show conversations. So let’s get to know Lynn a little bit there. So where did you grow up, Lynn? And you gotta give us some anecdotes about your upbringing, including one topic we’ll bring up here in just a second.

Len DeCandia (02:05):

All right, that sounds good. Yeah, so I, uh, I’m based in New Jersey and I actually grew up in Hoboken, New Jersey, uh, which is directly across the Hudson River from Manhattan. Uh, and both of my parents were Italian immigrants. So, uh, it was, uh, a fun, uh, youth, uh, being a little bit different than everyone else and trying to assimilate and acclimate, uh, to the American lifestyle. And Hoboken was famous when I was growing up because it’s the, uh, childhood home of Frank Sinatra. I actually grew up on the same street that Frank Sinatra grew up on. Wow. And I won’t sing for you because none of that kind of rubbed off on me.

Scott Luton (02:43):

<laugh>. Hey, let me ask really quick, Kelly, are you a Frank Sinatra fan? We remember we hadn’t broached the subject before.

Kelly Barner (02:50):

Oh, I am a big Sinatra fan, and I may not look at, I know I have the Boston Irish thing going <laugh>, but my mother’s maiden name is for Brio. Oh, perfect. So Sunday night dinners, you open the bottle of wine, you’ve got meatballs cooking all day long. You gotta put on Frank Sinatra, Nixon, a little bit of rat pack. Absolutely.

Scott Luton (03:07):

Oh man, I love that image you just painted. So, um, alright, so Lynn, uh, she alright. She broached food. We love talking food here at Supply Chain. Now, what is one food dish that was inseparable from your upbringing?

Len DeCandia (03:22):

Oh, eggplant Parmesana. I mean, for me, that is like the go-to meal. Um, and you know, today everyone really knows a lot of these famous Italian meals, but for me, growing up, I was always different. Uh, you know, we’d be out playing on Friday nights and in the normal American household, Friday night was pizza night. Right. Uh, but for, for Roman Catholic Lennon family, even though it wasn’t Lent, um, every Friday night was fish soup night. So you can imagine what it was like seeing all my friends all excited about going home to have pizza, and I had trudge home to have fish. So, but you know, now it’s a delicacy. Right. It’s something I, you know, I look forward to having whenever I have a chance. Uh, my mom still makes it. Uh, we’ll leave it at that. I don’t want to go any further about fish

Scott Luton (04:10):

<laugh>. Well, hey, one more question then I, we wanna bring up one of our favorite shows. Uh, I think there’s some, there’s some, uh, common threads to, uh, kind of kidding aside, you, you talked about your folks, um, assimilating into, you know, society and whatnot. And you kind of touched on that in a second, you know, second ago with the pizza night versus, uh, fish soup night. But kidding aside, what, um, what did you observe your parents do as they, as they, you know, got used to, um, you know, living here in the States and of course your upbringing? How did they, how did they cross? How did they, um, build those bridges?

Len DeCandia (04:44):

Yeah, I think, you know, I was the oldest, and I think as I started to go to school, uh, things changed. I, I literally spoke Italian before I spoke English. Wow. Which was great, because when you learn another language as a young child that stays with you for life, it’s just an amazing experience. But as I started to, uh, go to school and, and bring English language into the house and complain about not having pizza on Friday night <laugh>, um, I, I started to see my parents becoming a little bit more comfortable adopting some of the American, uh, experiences and standards. But it took them, it took them quite a while to do that because, and I see it all the time. I think one of the, you know, dimensions that I’m always interested in, um, is really the challenges of being a first generation American. And I see so many young people, uh, in our country today who still, uh, do a great job of two things. One, you know, growing up as a child, but usually when you are, in my case, the oldest, you’re also help your parents. You’re responsible for helping them read things and understand, you know, how, how to, uh, go about, uh, you know, just living their lives. Uh, so it’s, it’s a, a greater sense of responsibility.

Scott Luton (06:00):

Man, I really loved your answer there, and thank you for, uh, indulging us with that. Kelly, before I take a hard right. Turn your thoughts on what Lynn just shared.

Kelly Barner (06:08):

No, I, I a hundred percent appreciate that. My dad was first generation American. Both of his parents were from Ireland. Um, and it wasn’t too many generations back that my mom’s fa family was adjusting from, from Italy. Then you had the, you know, the Ireland and the Italy coming together, which was an interesting mix <laugh>. Um, but it, it is, it’s, it’s a rich opportunity, but there is a lot of responsibility that comes with, at an adjustment and being a kid sort of functioning as the go between for your parents. Um, I’m, I’m sure it didn’t always feel awesome at the time, but probably looking back, there were a lot of special moments that as you became an adult in your perspective, broadened, I’m sure that you had some memories about things that you helped them transition into that you could really treasure.

Len DeCandia (06:52):

Hmm. Well said.

Scott Luton (06:54):

I think as, as, uh, the, the United States continues to be a, a greater and greater melting pot, which is such a beautiful thing, I think we can all probably be more mindful of helping folks make that transition and being good friends and neighbors. And, because, you know, that takes a lot of bravery. I can only imagine some of the stories that, that, but you both could share. And as we look back at, uh, previous generations, some of the, uh, the bigger struggles of the time that have become almost kind of like you assume it’s just, it takes place these days. So I appreciate y’all both sharing there. Um, okay. So on a much, much lighter note, uh, what we uncovered in a pre-show, Kelly, was that not only is Lynn a fellow big fan of one of the best, best TV shows of all time, The Sopranos, but Lynn, I believe, um, you walked some of those paths where it was filmed and probably a lot more. Sure. Tell us, tell us about your personal connections there.

Len DeCandia (07:46):

Sure. Well, you know, I think The Sopranos was just voted the number one television show of all time by, uh, Rolling Stone and rightly so just a, a show ahead of its time. Um, but when I was working up in the northern part of New Jersey as Chief Supply Officer for Roche Pharmaceuticals, I was right in that whole territory where they would film and they filmed on location. Uh, and it did a fantastic job of it. And they actually used some of the locals, uh, for, for some of the, the background. I have a cousin who I think he sat through, uh, one of the funerals, if I’m not mistaken, of one of the soprano family members. Really?

Scott Luton (08:21):

Yeah. Um, <laugh>. There, there I am. There I am. See, no, not there. I,

Len DeCandia (08:28):

Um,

Scott Luton (08:28):

Well, I love that. And I’ll tell you, uh, I think we shared a pre-show, uh, Kelly, uh, Amanda and I, my, um, my significant other, we watched just re-watched every show. Yeah. Because we were looking for something that, you know, we could, we could put in the background that we enjoyed as we’re knocking out working on laptops, dualing laptops on the couches, if, if, uh, y’all can, uh, relate.

Len DeCandia (08:49):

Yeah. James Gini, who was the star of the show, uh, I went to college with him. He was actually the, uh, bartender at the, at the student pub when I went to college. The drinking age was still under 21. Um, and he literally sat maybe a row or two away from me at the football games with his family. So I had a chance to, to say hi to him a few times. And, uh, we lost him way too young. A very talented man, just did a, a fantastic job and, and a, and a, a true hero for, for many of, uh, of, uh, the Rutgers graduates.

Scott Luton (09:20):

You are so right there. And I knew that was, I knew, uh, uh, couldn’t quite remember that connection, but Kelly, how cool is that?

Kelly Barner (09:27):

And I think what I’ve heard, Len, he was an incredibly nice guy in real life. He was. So all of his success and his fame has notoriety. He stayed sort of a, um, a down to earth soul, somebody that you’d actually wanna know.

Len DeCandia (09:40):

Yeah. Very approachable and very involved with the university and helping the students, and, uh, very supportive. Again, it was just so sad to see him go so young. Uh, but he’s left an incredible legacy. Um, and I believe his son actually, uh, starred in the most recent movie. And I remember when his son was like two or three years old on his shoulders at the football games. It’s, uh, just an amazing thing. But, you know, just super talented, What can I say about New Jersey? Frank Sinatra, The Sopranos <laugh>, you know, what else can we give to the world?

Scott Luton (10:10):

Hey, shaping the 20th and 21st century for sure. Um, but that’s great. And, and it sounds like he truly had to be a great actor, uh, given how he was, he was naturally geared, perhaps. Um, okay. So we could probably talk, um, on all kinds of things for a couple hours here, Lynn, but, but I know our listeners are looking forward to your procurement and supply chain and global business expertise and perspective. So I wanna start taking a, a step in that, in, in that direction. So I wanna start with one of our favorite questions here, especially given the last couple years where we have, gosh, had some, some days, I bet I’ve had a dozen eureka moments. So for you, Lynn, what was a career, uh, a key eureka moment in your career? Especially one that maybe some of our new supply chain graduates can benefit from their listening?

Len DeCandia (10:57):

Yeah. You know, I probably, um, early in my career, and you have to understand, you know, you didn’t really have the vernacular supply chain until the early to mid nineties. Um, and I was, I think, the first person at Roche to have the title of vice president of supply chain management. So, um, there was no, no real playbook, uh, for any of us. We were putting in these, you know, big enterprise planning systems, and then we had to, you know, find ways to be productive. But probably for me, what I found, the big eureka moment, I think it’s important for a lot of young people who go into supply chain is really about, um, understanding the priorities of the organization so that your work is, is very much aligned with where the organization wants to go. Um, and, you know, in that first big assignment, uh, I found an organization that was when I took over, uh, stretched and really not executing very well.

Len DeCandia (11:55):

Uh, and one of the, one of the things I tried to do is really understand how people were spending their day, you know, a day in a life type of experience. And when I found that the organization, I did an inventory, there were over 200 active projects going on. Um, and so I started to ask the three why questions, Like, why are we doing this project? Why is it important to the business? Why are you spending a lot of time on this? And, uh, and found through that whole experience when you looked at dimensions like sponsorship, allow to the big strategy, really understanding what was happening outside the factory floor, that we really should have only been working on 80 projects as opposed to over 200. And so, uh, that, you know, that took a little bit of courage because I had to go to many senior level executives, um, and challenge why they were using the company resources on projects that, uh, really weren’t, uh, going to make a difference in our strategy. So I think for me, um, when, when it all comes down to excellence and execution, you know, just make sure that you’re not over complicating it, that you really understand the priorities, you’re validating those priorities, and that you see your role as really being at a, a role that adds value to what’s trying to be accomplished very easily, especially in large organizations. You can co be caught up in the complexity and, uh, and not really be, uh, in a, in a position, uh, to me making a difference.

Scott Luton (13:16):

So good. Uh, a lot of goodness there, you know, the power of the fo power of focus is one of the things I heard there as well. Um, Kelly, this is almost a, a wonderful segue into one of your next questions for Lynn. Right?

Kelly Barner (13:27):

It is, and first of all, Lynn, we congratulate you on your recent retirement. Um, so as you reflect back on your career and all the different leadership positions that you had the opportunity to hold, what was one that really impacted not just your career trajectory, but also potentially your worldview?

Len DeCandia (13:48):

Yeah, that’s a great question, Kelly. I think, you know, for me, um, having been in the pharmaceutical business and having, um, you know, been in a leadership role during nine 11, uh, and you can understand, we, in terms of where I was based, was only about three or four miles from, uh, the island of Manhattan. So we could see what was happening there. And, and coming out of nine 11, you know, what we recognized was there was a lot of vulnerability, um, in, in many of our supply chain, uh, practices, uh, specifically with pharmaceutical products. Um, and so I left the manufacturer assignment and to really understand what happened to product once it left our distribution sites, um, and took over supply chain responsibilities for a company called AmerisourceBergen. And, and what I found was there was a lot of risk in the pharmaceutical supply chain.

Len DeCandia (14:40):

It operated in a very strange way for, for many, many years because it was a growing business. It, it operated in a, in a mindset of buy and hold where companies or distributors were buying product, um, and waiting for price increases, and then obviously making profit through the price increase. But that led to multiple distributors being around and the inability to really follow the pedigree of product from source of manufacturer, uh, to, to source of dispense. So literally, uh, it, I, uh, took on the responsibility of, of changing the way products are distributed in, in the United States, um, and negotiated directly with every company that manufactured a product that was distributed in the United States. And we eliminated, um, all of the secondary distributors that were, uh, available. And what we put in place was a supply chain that could follow the pedigree of the product from the manufacturing floor right to the point of this fence.

Len DeCandia (15:42):

And I found great collaboration. It was, I believe, over 350 manufacturers, You know, could you talk about exclusive drugs and generic drugs? We found that it created, uh, greater collaboration because data could be shared now, uh, in a more real time way. Uh, and that helped with shortages and being able to move inventory to where it was needed. You know, you get into seasons like cold and flu and so on, and it becomes very difficult to know where inventory is. Or even sometimes there’s risk with oncology drugs and being able to get them, uh, to where they were needed. So what I found in that assignment was, uh, an incredible level of collaboration by some very big players. You’re talking about a $400 billion industry with a commitment to putting in place a supply chain that was safe, efficient, and effective. Uh, and for me, uh, when I initially took on that assignment, it felt like a pretty daunting task.

Len DeCandia (16:37):

You know, how am I gonna convince all of these manufacturers? My board really challenged me. They didn’t believe that, uh, the companies would cooperate because it was a little bit of a, of a difficult relationship between the manufacturers and the distributors at the time. Um, but when you can accomplish something like that with, uh, a common purpose with, uh, mutual objectives for success with, uh, transparency and trust, uh, you can make, you can make big things happen. And it, it gave me the confidence that, uh, you know, supply chain could be more than just getting the, the product into the customers and the patient’s hand.

Kelly Barner (17:16):

Absolutely. You know, and it’s interesting because you mentioned what you learned during nine 11. It actually doesn’t sound all that different from what many companies and industries and professional learned during covid 19. And so, as much as these events have become landmark moments, and, and we certainly worry about the greater impact, uh, they do have a way of focusing us on things like traceability and, and visibility. Um, that’s, it’s incredibly interesting. It’s funny, Scott, for all the conversations we have with, with people about how did Covid and the pandemic affect the way you see the world do your job? Uh, it’s, it’s been a while since anybody’s mentioned nine 11 and absolutely, I can see where that impacted the pharmaceutical industry. Mm.

Scott Luton (18:02):

Well said, well said. Uh, and provenance, of course, one of Greg White’s favorite words of all time <laugh>. Um, but, um, I, I really appreciate your reflections already. Um, you know, a lot of this came out in the pre-show, uh, Kelly, we, I think you and I both left. Okay. We’re gonna package up like a seventh part series with Lynn, because there’s so much goodness in, in his journey. And, and, um, also how you, you were changing and challenging how supply chain was done earlier in your career. Lynn, I think if our listeners can really already with what you shared, if they, if they, um, uh, grasp one thing is that, ask those, as you call it, a three wises, ask those questions, challenge assumptions, you know, don’t, you know, carry the banner, the status quo. Cause there’s always a better way of doing things. So, Kelly, it’s good stuff. I need my popcorn and my diet Coke already. Huh?

Kelly Barner (18:56):

<laugh>. Well, good, because I’m gonna do a Dial p takeover mid-interview. Uh, I would be completely remiss if we had Len here, and I didn’t ask him about some of his observations that specifically relate to procurement. Um, Lynn, I’ve been in procurement for almost 20 years. I can’t believe how much has changed. And when we think about what’s changed in the last 20 years, and you look at what’s changed in the last two or three, and it’s absolutely mind blowing. So I’d be curious to hear your perspective around maybe what hasn’t changed within procurement as well as what has, And certainly if you have any predictions for the future, we’ll take them.

Len DeCandia (19:33):

Yeah, sure. Well, you know, I think the pandemic really had an ability to accelerate the value of procurement. Um, and I think for many companies, the way they worked with their suppliers before the pandemic directly correlated with how well they were made their way through the pandemic and are making their way through none of this, this new era, whatever we would like to call this new era. But we are, I believe in, in an era of significant change and, and transformation. Um, and I think the, the early thoughts about procurement was purely, um, uh, around value capture. You know, get, get the best price or get the best cost. And I don’t think we’ve seen people sacrifice quality or anything beyond that. It was just very cost oriented and it was more earnings oriented. Uh, and I think what we’ve learned, uh, through the pandemic is that procurement is really growth oriented, right?

Len DeCandia (20:23):

The reality is, what I’ve seen in my 40 years is, uh, a greater, um, relationship outside of an organization. So companies were very vertical, whether you were in the auto industry or the technology. Yes. Even in the pharmaceutical industry, you basically did all of your own r and d and you executed all the various steps of your product. Uh, but now everything is really associated with relationships and collaborations in different parts of the world for different markets, from markets to markets. And, uh, when you look at the pandemic in our era right now, where things are really operating more in cycles as opposed to continuous flows, so you’ll, you’ll have peaks and valleys, uh, and everything seems to be out of phase. You know, everything’s out of phase with what’s happening to the customer. Um, and everything’s out of phase as it relates to the investor.

Len DeCandia (21:12):

Um, and, and I think if you have the ability to put your product on your shelf, on the shelf and provide a service and your competitor cannot, you’re growing. She, and I think that’s what people are starting to recognize around the value of procurement. Um, because if you’re baking a cake, if one ingredient is missing, you’re not baking that cake. Right? Yeah. Uh, and as well as we spent a lot of time in the pandemic really concerned, and rightly so around the health of our employees. Um, but I know, um, during my tenure at Johnson and Johnson through the pandemic, I spent a lot of my time worried about the employees at my suppliers, over 4,000 of them. Yes. That at least allowed us to keep making life saving drugs. Um, and when you have, uh, markets that are opening and closing, right? Understanding not only the health and safety of your supplier employees, but the relationship with that supplier, not only with you as a customer, but with the government entity that they’re working with, the regulatory environment that they’re operating in.

Len DeCandia (22:12):

So procurement has become significantly more sophisticated. Um, and if you go beyond just a traditional supply chain, I spent a lot of my time in the, in the areas like IT support, human resources, support. Yeah. Uh, and ensuring that a lot of our suppliers in those areas as well were up and functioning and able to execute projects that were in the works. So, uh, I think for those organizations and those CEOs, um, who see the value of the supplier with an equal importance as they see the value of the customer, they’re gonna do extremely well, um, in this next decade, which puts a lot of pressure on the next generation chief procurement officer. They really need to speak a very different language, and they really need to think about the value contribution of their team. Uh, in this new world where procurement is much more aligned with growth, you’ll always have to bring value, but you have to bring value with growth.

Kelly Barner (23:11):

Absolutely. No, I think that’s a terrific point. And certainly we’ve seen the shift from people ending up in procurement because you got sent there to people ending up in procurement because you chose to work there. It’s an excellent way to get a sense of how all the different parts of a company and the associated supply chain work together. But

Scott Luton (23:29):

One thing, it’s no surprise that procurement and purgatory are so clo, they sound so much alike.

Len DeCandia (23:35):

Kelly <laugh>,

Scott Luton (23:36):

I’m just kidding. I’m just kidding.

Kelly Barner (23:38):

Seriously, its hard being the procure

Len DeCandia (23:41):

Person here.

Kelly Barner (23:42):

Atp. I mean, weird supply chain now. Um, procurement is not purgatory. I would just like to point that out. Procurement is a wonderful place to be. Heaven may not begin with a p

Scott Luton (23:52):

I’m all, I’ve just,

Kelly Barner (23:54):

It’s a silent p

Scott Luton (23:55):

When you, when you mention the folks getting sent to procurement as if like getting sent to detention Hall, that’s what came to mind. But I, I know, you know, we’re big fans and we’ve got, uh, procurement and Dial P and Kelly Barner and now Lynn tattooed on our, our right shoulder. So big fans here.

Kelly Barner (24:11):

Well, and to be fair, one of my very favorite books about procurement, uh, it’s called the Procurement Game Plan, describes procurement as like the island of misfit toys from Rudolph, the Red Nose, reindeer, <laugh>. It’s where you got sense of that no one ever had to see you again. So we have progressed from that. You know,

Len DeCandia (24:27):

Kelly, did you, did you know that they had to change the ending of that show? I bet you didn’t know that.

Kelly Barner (24:33):

Did not know. I remember, was it originally like a Tony Soprano ending and they had to clean it up a little

Len DeCandia (24:38):

Bit? It’s similar, but I’m old enough to remember watching it the first time it was on television, if you could imagine that. But the first time that show was on Santa just flies by the island of misfit toys and leaves them there. Uh, and so there was this big uproar Oh, that you can’t leave the misfit toys on now. They literally had to change the ending and, and rightly so. So, uh, but you know what, procurement is more of a destination. I will tell you, Scott, I was at, uh, you know, I have a strong affiliation with Rutgers University and helped us start the supply chain department there over 20 years ago. That’s right. Yeah. And I was at, uh, uh, one of the meetings a couple of weeks ago at the supply chain center, uh, where we have faculty and business leaders, and many of my, uh, supply chain colleagues were complaining to me because many of the young people coming out of the program wanna go into procurement as opposed to going into supply chain because of exactly what Kelly was saying.

Len DeCandia (25:34):

Because, you know, for them it’s the ability to look across the entire organization and work with r and d and work with the commercial teams, work with the technology teams, uh, as well as the traditional supply chain. Um, and it really asks them to be better business people by really understanding the relationships, the critical relationships that you have with suppliers across the entire, the entire org. I mean, that’s why I spent my first 12 or 13 years as a chief supply officer, but the, the past 12 as a chief procurement officer, because I spent enough time in plants and warehouses, and I felt that, you know, the supply chain experience was valuable because you understood the complexity of what it really takes to be able to, to provide your product, uh, and or service. Uh, but I also felt that if I could influence some of the decisions early in design and evolution, right, with the sensitivity and understanding of what happens during the execution phase, I might be a more valued contributor to the organization. And, uh, I’ve seen a lot of that with the, with the dynamic of digital technology that’s really elevated the function.

Scott Luton (26:43):

So, um, I’m, I’m so glad you mentioned the Rutgers tie in there, cuz uh, that’s something we definitely wanna ask you about mck Kelly, uh, before we head into ESG and some getting some, uh, Lynn’s thoughts there, I know regulation, especially given some of the environments, um, that Lynn served in your, your, uh, question thoughts there.

Kelly Barner (27:01):

Sure. And you had actually brought up regulation in some of your earlier comments, Len. I mean, certainly we know that pharmaceuticals are a very heavily regulated industry and for good reason mm-hmm. <affirmative>, right? There’s human lives and, and health and wellbeing on the line. But how would you say that the presence of that regulation affected the way that the supply chain was managed, the way that procurement activity and supplier relationships were approached? How did regulation come into your day to day?

Len DeCandia (27:29):

It’s significant, right? If you look at in the life science business, the regulatory bodies, the multiple regulatory bodies that are associated with the approval of not only your product, but the execution of that product and the management of that product. So that is new. The other piece though, um, is the world we live in today, right? With the dynamic of the pandemic climate change in the geopolitical aspects of it we’re, it’s almost as if supply chain is being weaponized. Um, and so now the whole concept of what you can source and where you can source it from or how you can execute has become a significant challenge for all business leaders. And I think, you know, I grew up in the world where we came up with this concept of supply chain, and if one of the links was weak or broken, we found a way to keep it going.

Len DeCandia (28:25):

But now, when multiple links are weak or broken, it’s very difficult and very challenged. And so, you know, I’m thinking more about supply hubs as opposed to supply chains only because of the dynamic of the regulatory aspects, the local aspects. Um, also the issues of markets opening and closing sources coming and going. Um, you just, you just can’t rely on that abundance being available to you. You really have to rely on managing risk and taking the risk out and being more relevant and closer to where the customer is and executing closer to the customer. Mm-hmm.

Scott Luton (29:05):

<affirmative>. So, um, uh, and, and I don’t mean this lighthearted fa uh, in light hard fashion, but I just re-watched Dallas Buyer’s Club, which is a fascinating movie, Oscar winning movie, right? Um, I can’t even remember the lead actor, uh, Matthew McConaughey lost like 40 pounds a play. The role talk about dedicated

Len DeCandia (29:24):

Gary Lito, right? He was,

Scott Luton (29:27):

Yeah.

Len DeCandia (29:28):

I love boobie buff.

Scott Luton (29:29):

And well talk about, um, where there is a, a common theme here is that that creative source and to get around all the highly regulated, you think back in the eighties and and nineties, uh, of, of, of the environment, uh, especially related to lethal diseases, and they get around it to find something that works. And then the explosion of popularity. I mean, I forgot, frankly, and shame on me. I forget, I’d completely forgotten about the movie. So listeners check out do, uh, Dallas Buyers Club. It is a gym, and, uh, you’ll make the connection to kind of this regulatory conversation we’re having. Um, okay. So let’s talk for a second, um, Kelly and Lynn about, uh, esg, right? So everybody and their brother and sister knows what that stands for these days, but maybe for two or three folks, it may not. Environmental, social and governments, right? Uh, a highly important, um, lots of outcomes driven by many initiatives. I think, uh, Kelly and I have chatted about how, you know, some companies are still trying to find that business outcomes approach to esg, but also the importance of sustainable procurement, right? Alluding to some of your thoughts a minute ago, Lin, um, two part question here. What’s your vision for how companies navigate this space successfully with outcomes? And from what you’ve seen, what are some of the challenges there to really getting, um, you know, powerful ESG programs off the ground with results?

Len DeCandia (30:53):

Yeah, let me start with the second question first, because my greatest concern right now is we, we live in a world of promises. Um, and, and it’s easy to make a promise 20 or 30 years out when you’re probably not gonna be in a leadership position to make sure it’s executed. And so I think I find it very difficult to really understand some of the promises that are being made around issues like climate change and, and, and scope of missions and so on, right? Um, I think because of that, there’s, there’s no standard, there’s no standard of metrics. Um, I think many are challenged with the issue of transparency. So, you know, the early issues now, if you’re gonna make a promise, will you keep it? And how you’re gonna measure your ability, um, to do that. And a lot of it really does fall on, on those of us in the supply chain.

Len DeCandia (31:44):

Uh, many organizations have been very good and very diligent in managing what’s under their roof. So within their four walls, whether it’s their, uh, their sites, um, uh, they’ve been able to to use, uh, uh, you know, a lot of great new technology around regenerative energy and so on. But the dilemma becomes when you start to be responsible as an influencer on your suppliers and the ability of your suppliers to maybe embrace some of those practices. And when your suppliers are in all parts of the world. So if you look at countries like China and India, some of their broader commitments to climate are about 30, 40 years out. So it’s very difficult as any type of a, a global company as the companies that I’ve led, um, to be able to make promises when you have a number of suppliers and sites in those parts of the world.

Len DeCandia (32:32):

So I think environment is really gonna require a significant level of collaboration and alignment. The one piece where I’ve seen some, uh, and experienced some, some great progress, um, is, is really in the issue around, uh, sustainability and citizenship and really having a positive impact on, on society. And, and so I’m a big believer in what I call social impact procurement. Um, and I felt one of the taglines that we had when I was running the, uh, procurement at Johnson and Johnson was how do we use our big for good, right? Um, and in early in my tenure, you know, we were, j and j was a great leader in this space, but they had leveled out, um, in terms of their percent of spend with diverse suppliers. And so, you know, we talked about what is going to allow us to double it, How can we double it?

Len DeCandia (33:26):

You know, go for a big goal and let’s, and let’s go after. And, and I think we found two great enablers. You know, one was technology and we literally, uh, partnered, uh, with SAP and created what we called, uh, the, the, uh, diverse marketplace by diverse marketplace, right? So you could actually go in and buy from diverse suppliers, but the big change was to engage the entire j j community around the world, the budget owners. Cuz in reality, procurement doesn’t own any budget. They’re a facilitator, they create an environment, they’re an enabler. So how do we enable the budget owners who wanna have a positive impact to participate in the process? And it was about education, but most importantly, we had to take friction out to take friction out of those diverse suppliers being able to become approved in a company like Johnson Johnson, which could, which could be a nightmare.

Len DeCandia (34:17):

So we had to take that friction out, and we had to take the friction out from the budget owners who wanted to work with diverse suppliers. Uh, and the reality is we had to kill a perception, a perception that working with a diverse supplier was going to have, uh, an impact on cost or quality. The reality was, many of these diverse suppliers were local, they were innovative, and they knew our customers better than we did. And so we found, we learned so much from these diverse suppliers. And more importantly, during the pandemic, when markets were opening and closing, since we had the ability to do this in, in dozens of countries around the world, our ability to source more locally with many diverse suppliers allowed us to continue to provide goods and services. And I think that was very eye opening to the broader organization.

Len DeCandia (35:04):

So I think the ability to use your budget owners to have a positive impact in a world that’s looking for more purposeful organization and wanting to be part of a purposeful organization is gonna allow you to, to win big in the talent space because talent wants to be part of the solution, and they wanna work with organizations that want to be part of the solution as it relates to esg. Lynn, Oh, man, okay. I had a lot of passion for this one, <laugh>. Well, if I can do this for another, if I, I can help companies really be better in their ESG practices, then I’m living the dream relative to this next chapter in my

Scott Luton (35:47):

Life. And, you know, that, um, Kelly, uh, that is honest and genuinely we saw that in a pre show when we’re off camera, clearly that is a passion of yours. And Lynn, we need, I think global industry needs that by the truckload, no pun intended. Um, alright, so Kelly, really quick, I’m, we’re gonna dive in a little deeper to supplier diversity. Who, Lynn touched on it a second ago, but what you hear there, what, what do you, what’s should our listeners really, you know, focus in on what Lynn just shared?

Kelly Barner (36:14):

I think the most important thing that Len pointed out is this idea of making a promise, because that’s the easy part, right? You make the promise, but who is ultimately going to carry that out? Who’s gonna be held accountable? What resources are they gonna be given to deliver against that promise? Because even as you had mentioned around sort of supply chain risk and visibility, Len, historically that’s all been viewed as very internal. How sustainable is our facility? How diverse is our workforce? And so those could be internal promises. But now with the potential of the larger ESG concept, we’re talking about making external promises, which means that there’s real downside to not being able to deliver. And so taking the vision around something, whether it’s sustainability, work safety, supplier diversity, any of those things, and operationalizing them at scale, that’s the hard part. And that’s where you really do have to really lend, almost go back and answer all of those why questions that you talked about earlier, but make sure everyone in the organization understands and has bought in, because it’s not something that one person or one team can execute on their own.

Kelly Barner (37:20):

It’s sort of a whole company wide effort.

Scott Luton (37:23):

Love that. Kelly. Man, y’all two got me ready to run through the wall back behind me. Y’all really, uh, you’re bringing it here today. Um, so Lynn, you touched on supplier diversity, you know, uh, an area of, uh, um, big interest, uh, for Kelly and I and our team here, and thankfully the industry, right? We’re starting to see some, some really important results oriented supplier diversity programs for the, especially in the last few years. Um, your thoughts as you’ve seen that space evolve, uh, both from a c CPG standpoint and pharmaceutical standpoint. What are, what are, whether whether you wanna, um, you know, lift up maybe some, uh, of what you’ve seen really effective leadership embrace and, and so that, uh, it’s helped those programs be more successful? Or what’s one mistake, maybe time and time again you see organizations making when it comes to well intentioned, but uh, non-res results producing supply diversity?

Len DeCandia (38:21):

Yeah, let’s, well, let’s start with the life sciences. Let’s talk about what we just experienced with the, the pandemic, right? I think in the United States, the biggest impact was on the black and brown community, um, as it relates to, um, you know, just, just the severity of, and the tragedy of, of the pandemic here in the states. And, you know, one of the areas when, uh, yeah, we were involved as well as, uh, others in, in creating and, and introducing a vaccine, uh, for covid. And one of the things we wanted to do was to make sure that the clinical trial associated with it was diverse and, and actually ended up being one of the most diverse clinical trials, um, in the history of the industry, uh, and working with a critical supplier was how do you go and recruit in those communities where there was a lack of trust and a lack of alignment.

Len DeCandia (39:15):

Um, and so we, we really use not only the recruiting, but we also use some, uh, wonderful people on the public relations side who really stood out in front to be able to do that. So, you know, using diverse suppliers to engage that community to participate in something that was life saving during, you know, yeah, we’re talking about the greatest healthcare crisis of our lifetime. Uh, I think on the CPG side, uh, what we’re finding is what I had mentioned earlier, I think you have to use your diverse suppliers in more strategic and, uh, and in areas where maybe their voice and the voice of the communities that they represent haven’t been heard. Um, and so when you’re talking about areas on the commercial space, um, and the connecting with those communities as well as in the product development and product execution phase, uh, and I learned this great lesson when I was Chief Procurement Officer at Estee Water, right?

Len DeCandia (40:08):

So, you know, what do I know about makeup and skincare? You know, I can tell you about fish soup, but I don’t know much about, you know, eyeliner or anything like that. Don’t put it on your face the first <laugh>. But it was an incredible environment to work in because over 70% of our community were women. And the amazing insights and the understanding, you know, for someone who had to source innovation, execute innovation, and understand the experience of the customer, right? Not just the use of the product, but the overall experience. And I think as organizations recognize the value, the innovative insights associated with women owned businesses, minority owned businesses, uh, it’s incredible. And, you know, one area if I, if I could, uh, that was important to me and continues to be important to me was I was the executive sponsor at Johnson and Johnson for the second largest employee resource group.

Len DeCandia (41:04):

Uh, and that was the Alliance for Diverse Abilities. Um, and really this, you know, this included, uh, you know, visible disabilities, mental health and neurodiversity. Uh, and there’s a great article in the New York Times today about how the pandemic and these more flexible work environments are allowing more of that diverse community, uh, to, uh, contribute it and to be part of organizations. And I think that’s another voice that needs to be heard when we’re talking about, uh, diverse suppliers and minority groups. Uh, and I hope that’s a sustainable practice. Um, there’s just, uh, an incredible wealth of talent and insights, um, and companies and corporations have to become much more flexible in how they allow people to be productive, uh, because I believe that isn’t going to change. And, uh, and that’s a community that really is talented and has tremendous insights.

Scott Luton (42:00):

All right. So Kelly, I know you’re chomping in a bit and passionate about this topic, uh, your thoughts, and then we will roll right into, uh, one of your next questions.

Kelly Barner (42:07):

Well, I do think that the importance of of work groups, I mean, a relatively new concept, especially for a lot of sort of mid-size companies that don’t have the, the scope and scale of workforce that j and j does. Um, I think it’s nice because it gives people an opportunity that if they don’t happen to sit in procurement, but they have a passion for sustainability or diversity, it gives them an opportunity to get involved. And I think that’s a, a huge resource that, truthfully, I consider it a, a reminder, if you’re in procurement, if you’re a supplier diversity manager, go find this work group. If there isn’t one help start it. It’s an enormous sort of out of band resource or opportunity to connect with people that can help you get your day job done. So I think that’s a, a great turn, and it’s one that’s that much more successful because so many workplaces have gone virtual, and you can have those personal connections regardless of where you happen to sit geographically.

Len DeCandia (43:02):

Yeah, that’s a great point. I think, you know, we’ve spent a lot of time over the past decade or two with technology and being very focused on the customer experience. And, um, yeah, here’s a shameless plug. I just had a, uh, a paper published in, uh, supply chain, um, Review magazine around the fact that I believe we’re at an, we’re in an era now where we’ve been in a little bit of an imbalance. We haven’t really thought about the employee right experience and the supplier experience. And so if we can rebalance that around how do we align, uh, mutual goals, um, and ensure that we’re creating an environment that allows people to be most successful. And to your point, Kelly, you know, I think the issue there is, uh, more customization around what’s beneficial to the employee that allows them to be the most productive. And I think the same thing with the supplier as well as we’ve become customer oriented. The reality is we, most organizations can’t execute anything without the supplier. So how, how do we find that balance?

Kelly Barner (44:08):

Yeah, and that’s actually a great point because those supplier relationships were a huge part of what was tested operationally during the pandemic. I mean, it’s something that procurement has always been focused on. Most organizations strive to be a customer of choice. Uh, some surprises were had during the pandemic. We found out I thought I was such a great customer, not so much, you know, my suppliers weren’t necessarily there on the same level of relationship as, as I thought we were in any advice or lessons learned around that sort of supplier relationship, um, partnership type of experience from the last couple of years?

Len DeCandia (44:44):

Yeah, Kelly, you know, I think for us, um, we spend a lot of time as a leaders and organizations with a focus on managing people. Um, and if you look at a lot of the studies, they’ll tell you that 20% of your team does 80% of the work. And most organizations, 20% of your suppliers represent 80%. And, and I think, you know, understanding who those suppliers are and understanding that relationship is important, but I also believe that supplier relationship management isn’t just the purview of the procurement function. I think just as the HR organization is an enabler for people to be good people leaders, I think the responsibility of the procurement organization is to teach the broader organization, the budget owner, to be good supplier relationship management leaders, right? And, and making sure they’re collaborating, they’re aligned, they’re working for common goals. Uh, because when you deal with the environment we’re dealing with today, and if we either are in a recession or on the threshold of a recession, those organizations that have vulnerable, uh, balance sheets are really gonna be hurt through all of this.

Len DeCandia (45:51):

And so now execution has to improve. And the only way execution can improve is if you’re getting the most value and the most productivity from all of your resources. And many times, you know, organizations are vulnerable if their suppliers aren’t executing to their level of their need, whether it’s an IT deployment, whether it’s a recruiting process, whether it’s an agency working on your commercial strategies. I’m talking outside of our traditional product execution there as well. And I’m thinking about the broader organization. And, and so, you know, how how do procurement becomes the tide that lists all boats? How do you become great leaders, great advisors, great partners to help your internal budget owners be better externally?

Kelly Barner (46:39):

Right? And that’s, Oh, go ahead, Scott.

Scott Luton (46:43):

Uh, no, you’re, you were gonna make a, uh, a well founded and inspiring remark, and mine was gonna be a little more on the humorous side. So please, Kelly, what, what’d you hear? What’d you hear Lynn say there?

Kelly Barner (46:53):

Well, it’s interesting because you’re talking about sort of the connection between what procurement is capable of generating with partners outside the organization and connecting that to the types of relationships that we wanna have inside. Um, and, and again, you talked about customer experience, that idea extending into procurement as the procurement experience and what sort of, not just value do we provide for budget owners and distribute users, but what is it like for them to work with procurement? Um, certainly if, if I had a dollar lend for everybody, every time someone asked me, I can’t, I just be like, like Amazon, right? I mean, I know people in supply chain are constantly hearing that. We get it in procurement too. Why can’t it be like, I order things at home and they magically show up the next day. Um, I think we’ve made progress, but we’re maybe not there. Um, any, any perspective or thoughts on either what the idea of a procurement experience means, or what we can invest to improve it?

Len DeCandia (47:51):

Yeah, and I had a really good experience on my, um, my last assignment with Johnson and Johnson. We literally put in a, a global procurement system, uh, over 60 countries. And this is on the, the non-direct side. And what we saw through the evolution of that deployment was that you need to take friction out of the process, right? And you need to make it in, in a way that it becomes very easy for the budget owner, um, and, and actually present the world to them through the computer. Cause that’s basically what Amazon is. You’re presenting the world of markets to me through the computer. Um, and we were fortunate, um, and maybe a little bit ahead of our time cause we had a lot of it in place before the pandemic now. So now think about the fact that you’ve got 140,000 employees around the world.

Len DeCandia (48:38):

You’re making life saving drugs that you need to keep, keep going. And it’s not just the idea of getting, you know, the raw materials and consumables to the plants. You also need to keep your functions running while they’re working from home, um, and running, right? Because a lot of your suppliers are helping the, the technology wise, keeping it operating and running. And, and so because we had that ability at the fingertips of all of our employees around the world to be able to buy what they needed from home, we really focused on, on that experience and we saw a tremendous uptake. We’re talking about close to 90% use of preferred suppliers with that journey. We went, we, we cut our supplier base in half, we our cycle times from, uh, bo from the idea to buy to buying or cut in half. Uh, and also we, we embedded capabilities, um, into the budget owners as well.

Len DeCandia (49:26):

So we automated things like RFPs with approved suppliers. Um, and our net promoter score right before I was leaving was approaching, you know, 80%, which is unheard of for any kind of procurement experience. But we were able to get there only because we took a continuous improvement mindset. We listened to the budget owners, we understood where their pain points were, and we worked very closely with functions like legal to create multiple channels of buying. So we don’t buy just one way, you know, you have to look at risk in a two dimensional way, right? The higher the risk, maybe the more complex my process should be, the lesser the risk, the less comply, uh, complex my process should be. So we had a lot of easy pass type of buying. And so basically it was kind of trying to create an experience for the budget owner where it was convenient and easy for them to source and to know who to source from.

Len DeCandia (50:21):

So all the work behind the screen was understanding the markets, understanding those suppliers that brought the best value to the company, introducing diverse suppliers into that community, um, and actually being a problem solver. So the phone call from PR to procurement was not so much, I need to get a PO done, or I need to get a supplier paid for, is I’ve got a problem. Can you help me solve that problem? And that’s, that’s really jumping the curve around credibility. It’s also asking your procurement people to have a whole different set of competencies and skills, right? Better storytellers, better influencers, um, and better understanding of the business challenge with excellent procurement skills.

Scott Luton (51:02):

Yes, more sugar than vinegar also, uh, with,

Len DeCandia (51:06):

Yeah, that helps. <laugh>,

Scott Luton (51:08):

<laugh>, uh, it’s interesting. I, I love how, uh, you know, you mentioned earlier, uh, Kelly Lynn used this phrase, How do we use our big for good? And you’re kind of using it kind of outside the four walls in terms of, you know, driving good change, you know, across the globe. But I think you, from what you just described there, you were also using your big for good in terms of the supplier experience, the procurement experience, and probably developing what I heard, developing relationships where the suppliers wanted to do business with j and j. And that, as we’ve all seen, has served organizations really well in light of the last, you know, two, two and a half years. Um, one, one last thing I was gonna share, You’re going way back. Uh, Lynn, you shared, uh, you know, 80 20 and 2080 in terms of 20% of the folks to 80%, you know, somewhere Theore is smiling down, very proud. That principle is still relevant. So if you hadn’t heard of the Predo principle, make sure you, uh, Google that. Um, okay, so Kelly, um, uh, the PX of procurement experience, you know, the CX customer experience, the sx, the supplier experience, you name it, all these, these xs are so prevalent in industry today. You know, your final thought before we make, make sure folks know how to connect with Lynn, and, and we’re gonna mention Dial P as well. Uh, your final thought or question for Lynn in that regard?

Kelly Barner (52:33):

I think what I would say, and, and Lynn, this has been such an affirming conversation for me because I advocate on procurement all the time. I believe so much in the value that we bring. Um, but not everybody has experienced big procurement doing good internally and externally. And so I’m thrilled that we’ve captured your story and we’ve talked a lot about TV shows and movies. Uh, and I think one line that comes to mind for me from one of my very favorite movies, The Greatest Showman, is I will just say to you, if you have not seen procurement lately, you have not seen procurement. So give us another look.

Scott Luton (53:09):

<laugh>. Completely. Oh, Lynn, are you a big fan? I’m, I’m a huge fan of The Greatest Showman. Lynn, do you like that movie as well?

Len DeCandia (53:16):

You know, I, that’s one of them I think I saw once, but, uh, that’s with you, Jackman, is that? Yes. Yeah, I’ll have to go back and watch it then. Okay. I apologize, there’s

Kelly Barner (53:25):

Your homework assignment from today’s conversation.

Len DeCandia (53:27):

Perfect. I had a little bit more time. Now,

Scott Luton (53:29):

<laugh>, I find that invigorating and inspiring and, and, and I’m sure folks from all journeys in all walks of life can find, you know, it’s relevance in their, um, in their own journey. But from an entrepreneurial standpoint, man, it speaks volumes. Even if they did Lynn and, and Kelly perhaps dramatize, uh, the source material, but still a great movie, great songs. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. Okay. Who knows, I, I’ll leave that to the, uh, historians out there. But, um, Lynn, I’ll tell you, Kelly, as I as our hunch was there’s no way we could do Lynn’s perspective and expertise and, and journey and like, you know, a 60 minute episode. So we’ll have to have Lynn back. Um, in particular, uh, Lynn, I love your passion along the lines of really making it a better, more inclusive, more successful environment for all parties. So we’ll have to do a check in on that. Um, as you, you know, roll into your next, uh, board seats or an initiatives or you name it. But how can folks, whether they wanna bring you in and have a keynote, or if they wanna, you know, uh, um, talk shop on the back of a bar napkin at one of your, your favorite Frank Sinatra’s legendary restaurant, whatever the case may be, how can folks connect with you, Lynn?

Len DeCandia (54:41):

Uh, LinkedIn is probably the best bet, Scott. So I’m, you know, I’m on LinkedIn. I’ll always be able to, uh, to message back and, uh, we can take it from there. So, I, I really encourage people to use LinkedIn. I think it’s a great tool and I, I wish more people would use it.

Scott Luton (54:58):

Uh, agreed. Um, and I’ll tell you, uh, Kelly, uh, any of our students at Rutgers University, um, this has gotta make you very proud, right? So, uh, connect with Lynn, know, know your roots and, and know maybe some of those four bearers that help create the structure and the programming for what we all enjoy, especially that now generation that’s making such a big impact before they even graduate. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, uh, you know, with their undergrad. Undergraduate. Um, Kelly, uh, two quick questions as we still have Lynn here, and we’re gonna talk about it as if he’s not with us. Your favorite thing that Lynn shared here today, Right. And then number two, let’s make sure folks know where to get, you know, I’ll just pick it on. I’ll just in all good fun on procurement a second ago. Uh

Kelly Barner (55:41):

Oh. I know, because if you meant it, I would be on the way down there to Atlanta.

Scott Luton (55:45):

He’s got break by legs, Lynn <laugh>. Um, so

Kelly Barner (55:47):

I

Scott Luton (55:47):

Do it. Nice. What’s your,

Len DeCandia (55:49):

We’re gonna send Polly Walnuts asked you.

Kelly Barner (55:52):

Oh, there you go.

Scott Luton (55:53):

I’m gonna get, it’s gonna get, uh, challenging here. What, uh, so Kelly, what’s your favorite thing Lynn shared, and then where can folks, uh, find Dial P and what’s coming up next?

Kelly Barner (56:01):

So, my favorite thing, one of those P words, it’s back to the promise. Every single person in every single company is making a promise to somebody, possibly multiple somebodys. Your responsibility then becomes finding a way to keep that promise sustainably at scale. And all of our promises are different, but they are all equally important. So I think for me, that’s a huge takeaway. Um, if you wanna join me in land and revel in the wonderfulness of procurement, uh, you can find me personally on LinkedIn, but I would also recommend that you find Dial l p. There’s a new episode every single Thursday. We go between solo pods and important topics to video interviews and live streams. So check us out on LinkedIn, on supply chain now, on Twitter, and get involved in the conversation.

Scott Luton (56:46):

I love that. And after you connect with Lynn the candy on LinkedIn, find a procurement buzz on LinkedIn that is required reading. So y’all check that out. Um, thank you, Kelly Lynn. Thank you, Kelly and I, were looking forward to today’s conversation. I’m looking forward to, uh, sharing it with our global ecosystem. I think they’re gonna have their own key takeaways. I mean, it’s hard not to have a litany of things in sitting, you know, spending an hour with you, Lynn, I’ve got about, uh, 17 pages of notes on my end. Uh, but Lynn, thank you for the, for what you’ve done. Thank you for what you’re doing today, and thank you already for, for how you’re can continue giving back and giving forward, as we call it here at Supply chain now. Big thanks, uh, for your hour spent with us, Lynn.

Len DeCandia (57:30):

Well, thank you, Scott. Thank you, Kelly. It was a real pleasure. And, uh, I appreciate what you’re doing for the, the various functions and for the science of supply chain and procurement. Uh, it’s important work, it’s meaningful work, and I really encourage many young people to, to pursue a career in this area.

Scott Luton (57:45):

Mm, Well said, man. All right. We’ve been talking with Linda Toand, recently retired chief procurement officer of Johnson Johnson, and in a whole lot more, as, as you, if you’ve been listening to us last hour, you know what I’m talking about. Um, big thanks Lynn. Big thanks to you Kelly. Kelly Barner, always a pleasure to knock out these conversations with you. I’ll tell you, this is a good one, huh?

Kelly Barner (58:05):

I was glad to be here for it. Absolutely. It was a great one.

Scott Luton (58:08):

And to our listeners, thank you for tuning in. Uh, thank you for being with us on this journey, uh, as we sit down with movers and shakers like Kelly and Lynn, uh, tell you so much to learn here. Um, but whatever you do, uh, as Lynn and Kelly both are speaking to, it’s all about deeds, not words, right? Taking that action to drive change, meaningful change within your four walls and certainly outside your four walls. On that note, we challenge you on behalf of our entire supply chain, uh, supply chain now team to do good, to give forward and to be the change that’s needed. And with that said, we’ll see you next time, right back here at Supply Chain now. Thanks everybody.

Intro/Outro (58:46):

Thanks for being a part of our supply chain now, community. Check out all of our programming@supplychainnow.com and make sure you subscribe to Supply Chain now, anywhere you listen to podcasts. And follow us on Facebook, LinkedIn, Twitter, and Instagram. See you next time on Supply Chain. Now.