Supply Chain Now Radio Episode 300
Prefer to watch the podcast in action rather than just listen? Watch Scott and Greg as they welcomeWard Richmond and Tim Hinckley to the (temporary!) Supply Chain Now studio in Atlanta, GA.
“There is a legitimate space in the marketplace for those companies that provide the facilities and the capabilities that Amazon provides today because companies want the independence. They don’t want competition from their platform provider, and they don’t want this race to the bottom of pricing.”
– Tim Hinckley is Executive Vice President and Chief Commercial Officer of Radial
This podcast is part of the Supply Chain Real Estate series made possible by SupplyChainRealEstate.com. Tim Hinckley, Executive Vice President and Chief Commercial Officer of Radial, joins Supply Chain Now for the first time, while the team also welcomes back Ward Richmond, Executive Vice President and shareholder at Colliers International.
As demand for eCommerce participation has grown among traditional retailers, the role of companies like Radial has become even more important. They provide omnichannel commerce technologies and operations that emphasize multi-tenant, fractional ownership in their warehouses/distribution/fulfillment facilities while also handling the complex (and potentially costly) final mile.
In this interview, Tim shares some of his observations from over 3+ decades in supply chain with Supply Chain Now Co-hosts Greg White and Scott Luton, including:
· The fact that the often-touted ‘retail apocalypse’ should actually be seen as a retail renaissance
· The role that distribution infrastructure plays in dividing the retailers that are crushing it from the retailers that are getting crushed
· Why analytical capabilities provide critical insights to operators as well as 3PLs, making data as important as the software platforms put in place.
· Recent retail trends such as ‘popup’ stores, buy online pickup in store (BOPIS), and buy online return in store (BORIS), that can leverage the power of the supply chain
[00:00:05] It’s time for Supply Chain Now Radio Broadcasting Life Supply chain Capital of the country. Atlanta, Georgia. Supply Chain Now Radio spotlights the best in all things supply chain the people, the technology, the best practices and the critical issues of the day. And now here are your hosts.
[00:00:29] Hey, good morning. Scott Luton here with you, Lavern Supply chain. Now welcome back to the show. Today we’re continuing our popular Supply chain Real Estate dot com series brought to you by none other than supplychainrealestate.com. Stay tuned as we’ll be featuring a couple of guests that will certainly increase your Supply chain IQ. One quick programing note. Like all of our other series, you can find supply chain now wherever you get your podcast from, including Apple podcasts, Spotify, YouTube, you name it. We’d love to have you subscribe so you don’t miss a thing. So welcome in our fearless, esteemed co-host today. First off, Ward Richmond executive vise, president and shareholder at Colliers International Ward. How you doing? I’m doing great. It’s great to be back in Hotlanta. Great to have you back. It’s been too long. And we’ve had a couple of planning conversations or remote conversations, a podcast.
[00:01:18] But nothing is like having the wolf back in the room with you.
[00:01:24] Well, we’ve been we have been following you socially. I know you’ve had a busy calendar and we’re gonna pick your brain all kind of where you’ve been over the last couple of months. Momentarily joining us as well. Greg White 0 Supply chain Tech entrepeneur, supply chain adjutant and trusted advisor. Greg, good morning. Good morning, Scott. It has been quite an eventful morning.
[00:01:45] You know, it’s just another day at tech startup life. Holy mackerel.
[00:01:51] I don’t know if ah, I don’t know if our audience you know, if you’re watching this, you’re seeing an entirely new backdrop.
[00:01:57] That’s right. As the power was out at our studio, at our car park. Yeah. Two car accidents took the power out. So fortunately, we reached out to our friend Paul Dirigo at Salt Box Ryan, as is his business model, strangely. He just dropped us right in here. So very agile. Yeah. Perfect. Yeah. Yeah. It’s saved us. He’s our hero. He was a katana. We owe him at least lunch.
[00:02:20] That’s right. But as as our featured guest, which we’re into momentarily stated, you know, this is the industry we serve, people that are used to putting out fires and getting hit curve balls out of the park. So, you know, if we couldn’t put it together with quick, great friends like Salt Box, I’d be disappointed ourselves.
[00:02:35] You’re lucky I slept in this morning. So if you find anything in the sweep, no lights so worn.
[00:02:45] Greg, we have a great guest with us here in the studio today. Our remote studio here today. Tim Hinkley, chief commercial officer with radio. Tim, how you doing?
[00:02:53] Warily. Well, spurtle, pleasure to see everybody. Word. Always good to see you right back at you.
[00:02:57] Yeah, awesome. We’ve really enjoyed the pre-game warm ups and the conversation they get. Get a sense of who you are. I think our audience will really enjoy some of the stories you have and some of your perspective. So we’re going to dove right in in a second. But Ward, bring you back into the conversation. Okay. You know, you go from 4:00 a.m. to about 3:00 a.m., working hard, traveling hard, meeting clients, you know, gathering up and put your finger on the pulse of what’s going on across the global supply chain industry so you can be that that advisor for the folks that you help. And so you’ve you’ve been pretty busy last few months.
[00:03:35] Yeah, it it’s been a very busy year. I mean, it’s fortunate to be this busy. And then at times, as you know, it feels a little like a little sense of overwhelm.
[00:03:46] I’ve got to Atlanta yesterday and I’m home tomorrow and then I’m going to Las Vegas Friday and I get home on Tuesday. And that this is one of those weeks where it’s it’s probably over overkill as far as travel goes. Go get you like a good idea at the time, does it? I mean, I have to work on saying no to things, but there’s it’s very difficult right now. And you think you just got to strike while the iron is hot. Yeah. After it. And it’s just that that phase of life and that stage in the economy and all of that where things are just booming. Yeah.
[00:04:22] You got to make hay while the sun shone and for sure. So if we had to pick let’s pretend this is Supply chain Sports Center for a second and let’s get some of your highlights. And if he had to pick your top three from the time you were last in Atlanta. So I mean, with us at least you’re here regularly.
[00:04:38] But I haven’t been back. So if I come here, I’m kind of going to come to a fight. Can you also give us your top three? Okay. Top three. Well, the first is we when I was in Miami in December, right. And right before Christmas, we were going to do a remote with you guys and Greene Hardiman, X Grant Kada and. Yeah, 10x. That’s why I’m going to Vegas this weekend, actually, to hang with Grant. He’s doing his growth con his annual business conference there. So I’m excited about that. But I woke up at 3:00 a.m. and I normally wake up. You said for a week of L.A., 4:30, 4:45. It’s normal at 3:00 a.m.. It’s kind of messed up. Are you doing the Walbert workout or something? I like I like to get up. I like to get up early and get my workout in. And maybe I start working at like 7:00 and then I have lunch after lunch. I try not to schedule anything.
[00:05:33] I will. I’ll be available if someone needs to talk to me. But I don’t like to I don’t perform at my peak in the afternoon. So I would like to get up early, start my day and accomplish all my critical tasks before lunchtime. And then after lunch I just take a nap.
[00:05:50] Well, yeah, I do. I can. There’s no shame. I don’t know. Are you all familiar with Trammell Crow? Yeah. Yeah, absolutely.
[00:06:00] So Trammell Crow is legendary Dallas based real estate developer and actually went to my high school and self self-made man. I went to Woodrow Wilson High School downtown Dallas, Texas. D-S.D. And I’s, as did Trammell Crow. And I went to his funeral. I never actually met him.
[00:06:20] But he’s such a legend in my industry and being from my hometown and everything. And at the funeral or maybe even the obituary, I read that he took a nap every afternoon in his office. And I always felt the need to and then just became justified. I highly recommend it. I think it’s a healthy thing to do. And along with controlling her schedule and figuring out when you perform at your peak and when you’re, you know, optimize to go negotiate and make critical decisions and get it done. So all that means said 3:00 a.m. is too early. And I had to get on the plane, go to Miami. I got in a cab. The cab got in a wreck on the way to see Grant Cardone. And I mean, I I’m like barely going to make it with this whole the getting from Dallas to Miami and then to his office in Advent Tura as it is. So then it’s pouring down rain. I got out of the cab, grabbed my bags, walked across the street to a Burger King parking lot, called an Uber, got in. And we had this game plan that we’ve all collectively put together on how we’re going to interview the legendary Grant Cardone, New York Times best selling author. I think he has five million followers on Facebook just in two point five on Instagram.
[00:07:35] I know that. Yes. So if you don’t know, maybe it’s 2 million. I don’t know. But if you don’t know. Grant Cardone, he’s he’s kind of a big deal. If you’re in the retail real estate biz. Yes, right. Oh, yeah.
[00:07:47] It’s self-made billionaire and really, really cool story. But we had an interview that we had a format. We’ve come up with word of the three of us. We’re gonna be interviewing him, you guys remote here in Atlanta and me sitting with Grant in Miami. So when I got there, Grant being Grant just said, hey, man, why don’t you and I just go one on one in my studio and we do this. I’m texting Scott like, hey, man, that’s off. So. Wish me luck. And then we just went into like a one hour a small world off me.
[00:08:22] Greg, when they Burger King, when we got that text message from I hope it was a real burger and fake stuff because we got in early. Yes. And I skipped breakfast. I’m kidding. I didn’t have time to eat there.
[00:08:36] So, you know, it goes with the territory, as we all know. I mean, your media and digital media, you gotta be opportunistic. And of course, the video that you got, the two of your interviewing was gonna be a one of your highlights of, you know, really life.
[00:08:53] Yes. Especially the business side of life. And just it’s one of the things I was very I was unprepared to interview him for an hour and then it was great and be on. Right. So I pulled Dan Rather. You did a great job. Hey, when I was like 10 minutes in, I I just said a quick little thank you to the man upstairs. Yeah.
[00:09:12] That I’m on right now. You know, when you’re productive time. Oh, yeah, that’s right.
[00:09:20] It was good thing it was early but yeah. We it was really cool. I mean I think we between Facebook and YouTube it has close to a hundred thousand plus views. I’ve been getting emails from people around the world about it and it’s been. That was definitely a highlight of closing out the year that way. And then what else? I went to Ben Gordon’s Beach NSA Supply chain conference a few weeks back in West Palm Beach. Nice place. That’s the I mean, it’s it’s the best it’s the best hotel in India, in the U.S..
[00:09:56] So you went there and I went to NRF.
[00:09:58] You got us about it. I told you you needed to go so in.
[00:10:03] And I think our next podcasts that we’re doing. Ben Gordon is going to be our guest, so I’m looking forward to that wealth of knowledge. Yeah, yeah, he he is. And he’s just an expert in the supply chain realm. And just we’ve become really good friends. This is my fourth time to attend that conference. It’s very it’s a small conference. Lots of C-level executives are there and just a wealth of information. I I mentioned in our pre-show catch up here that I got to meet Brad Jacobs. And on the plant plane right out there.
[00:10:41] So great. So I can for our audience. That’s listening. We’ve got Grant Khadim was number one. We’ve got Ben Gordon number two, that conference number two. And now, as if that wasn’t incredible, stretch enough. Now we’re talking number three through highlights. Brad Jacobs, Brad Jacob, which is you present CEO of xbla. Yeah.
[00:11:03] Serial entrepreneur, multi-billionaire, self-made or have met also Brown University. He didn’t graduate from Brown. He but he did attend Brown. He told me that he the classes were just too big and kind of. It’s basically it was like I needed to just get going. And I mean, he did he did the jobs. Bill Gates and that’s. Yeah. So maybe, you know, that’s a pretty it sounds like that’s a strategic way to get going in life is just get going right when you’re ready. And t he’s proven to be extremely successful at that. And I was in meeting Brad. I knew he was going to be there at the conference. I’ve never really been in the same room as him. And I didn’t want to be the guy waiting in line to talk to Brad Jacobs, who is like at a supply chain conference. Like George Clooney. What, in the Hollywood Oscars? Yeah. The Oscars. Like he I mean, he.
[00:12:02] But so Brad was sitting there front and center throughout the entire especially the first day of the conference. I was I was watching him and he was so focused on the speaker, he never once looked at his phone. He was taking notes. And he he was just laser focused. And then I saw a window to go up to him and not have to wait in the line and kind of be like that. You know, the annoying person, we are just talking to his autograph. And I am a huge fan of his. And I just look up to him. And I think what he does in the Supply chain world, which is my world, is is just incredible what he’s built with Expo and just such a interesting guy. And I’ve never met him. So I found this window. I went over and I I actually had three different conversations with him over the course of the weekend. And every time he’s just laser focused, dialed in. He’s not looking over his shoulder. And you can just tell that that he is an extremely focused guy and and just treats in everybody with the utmost level of respect. That was really cool for me and being the supply chain nerd that I am. And that’s that was pretty cool. So, yeah, it does hurt Desser, I guess. A Magic 3.
[00:13:16] I love it. I love it. And you know, the hits are going to keep on common cause. Number four, we get the chance to interview Tim here in person on your visit into Atlanta. And we’ve got some great stories and some insights from Tim. He’s gonna share that we’ve already gleaned in the pre-show conversation.
[00:13:31] I’ll tell you, I met Tim at a conference to fairly randomly. I think he talked me to just be honest. He was talking. Yeah. I don’t want to tell the story. I mean, Tim is like the Brad Pitt of a Supply chain conference. Same thing. I don’t know about that.
[00:13:51] We were up in Chicago for Armstrong and Associates. So, Casta, I’ve known Dick Armstrong for a long, long time. And I knew Evan as well as son who’s now taken over the business. Yeah. And so they were kind enough to ask me to be a panelist and speak. And and then he did come on up to me and attack me.
[00:14:08] And yeah, I was willing. So and it’s been good ever since.
[00:14:11] So I’ve got my little Collier’s yeti. Yeah, he that’s good. You know, he’s he’s very smart about getting you something that you need in Atlanta in the summertime when it’s hot. Yeah, right. Give me something that keeps that beverage nice.
[00:14:22] Or Boston in the wintertime when it’s cold.
[00:14:24] It’s called a cold. Get a Starbucks there. It I’m trying to avoid caffeine today. I’m already hyped up. Not normally. So before the hot gas went. Don’t need that. But yeah.
[00:14:33] So that’s where we met. And we’ve been in touch ever since. And and it’s been a real joy because Mean is a super knowledgeable guy in the industry and the space. He’s been able to provide me some good insights. And hopefully I’m I’m being reciprocal in relationship.
[00:14:48] Definitely. No doubt. We’re glad to have you here and glad to have Ward back in Atlanta. So, Tim, let’s dove right into you’ll learn more about you. And as we’ve talked about before, went live here on the front end. We want to give our audience a chance to do what exactly we were able to we were able to get a sense of who you are to actually the person before we start talking shop and business and industry. So tell us about where you grew up and give us the skinny on your upbringing.
[00:15:12] Sheer Well, you know, it’s nice, Scott, and thanks for having me here. And the fact that I’m still able to have this after we had a preem meeting is a positive.
[00:15:20] You pass it, pass the test. You didn’t ask me to say, why don’t we have a technical difficulty hours out? It’s not working right now all over his schedule.
[00:15:29] So, you know, I’m I’m a I’m an army brat at heart. So my dad was in the army was born in Fort Leonard Wood, the army base. Oh, sorry. Not too far away from me in Kansas. Sarah moved around quite a bit and my dad went to work for a company called OWN’s Illinois. So what was nice is my mother was from Oklahoma. That’s my my Oklahoma out on ranches. And when the gas industry was booming. Yeah. And then flapped around with my dad and a lot of major cities, part of corporate life. So it’s kind of neat. I got to ride horses and shoot guns and drive trucks. When I was a young kid. Well, before you know it all being legal back east and then, you know, I come back east and you look like a little guy from the city, right?
[00:16:10] I was overalls. That’s why I didn’t wear overalls. But I would land.
[00:16:13] There was a wonderful place called shufflers. Well, where? In downtown Oklahoma City. So get off the flight. First thing we do is get Dan post-boom Wrangler jeans, get there a belt buckle. You know, I had to get the right shirt. You know, my grandfather would out outfit me soup to nuts and get my head shaved off because this is back in the 70s where I had long hair. And also I’d get the crew cut and just look like every other kid except, you know, I’d never did get an act for the red man. And the skull just couldn’t do that. But other nat-, you know, drink cause beard, I think at the ripe age of about 14 or 15, you know, and that kind of stuff. So it was good times and then bounced around a little bit like that and spent most of my high school and college years in the Ohio area. So Toledo, Ohio, I grew up there, went Bowling Green, and that was a time when that section of the country was really prosperous and booming. The auto industry was in its heyday. Yeah, I think Detroit was close to a couple of million people in population. Toledo was a Tier 2 city for all the automotive guys. All right. Head champion Sparkplug and you know, Libyan’s foreign Glatt, I mean, is everything. So it was a it was a it was a bright time in many ways because you saw all these jobs and how, you know, good the economy would be. And then by the time I graduated in the early 80s, the economy had just completely collapsed. Unemployment was in excess of 20 percent. And I was working for a couple of Cumming’s worked my way through college, which was interesting. That’s how I actually got into this business. Ironically, without knowing about as a friend of my dad’s worked at u._p._s. His kid did. And so he got me a job there, loaded trailers from 7:56 morning. And unbeknownst to me, you know, it just worked its way from there.
[00:17:51] So it’s it’s if you ever watch Steve Jobs Stanford commencement speech where he talks about patching the dots together, if you haven’t highly recommended Steve Jobs, Stanford commencement speech, a real eye opening for me because I listen to that when I came on out. You start looking back and you go, it all made sense. You know, I worked at u._p._s. Sort of boxes that worked at RadioShack pay my way through college. I remember those days. Yeah. You know, boomboxes, electronic parts and stuff. And you this isn’t a day where you actually merchandise the store as a store manager. It was your job to manage a store, manage your inventory, know the terms. And I remember talking to my dad ’cause I felt kind of defeated. You know, graduate college and I go back to working at RadioShack where it worked during college. And, you know, I’m like, wow, I’m not making a lot of money. And it wasn’t the job that most people aspired to, if you get my drift. And my dad had some great words of wisdom. He goes, let me understand this. You hire people, you fire people. You merchandise a store, you’re in charge of PNL. You do all this. He goes, I was like in my mid 30s before I was able to do a good point. Right. Your goal, you know, and he goes, you’re general businessman and you don’t even know it. You know, and it was a good life lesson for me. Yeah. And you know, that that gave me a lot of confidence, made me look at things a little bit differently.
[00:19:05] And then I worked my way through a bunch of other companies and ultimately landed at a little upstart company called our US back in the day. So I roadways roadway package system. So good friend of mine Rodway was in Akron. I was living in Toledo. So one of my best friends, he went Whittenburg graduated with some people that had connections to Akron, recruited me for a couple of years, you know, to come work for a roadway. And I said I didn’t go to college to work on a dock with a bunch of union guys. That’s not my idea. RadioShack seemed better than that at the time, but in 86 I had moved east for the Massachusetts miracle.
[00:19:45] Jobs weren’t doing well, actually, maybe closer to 85, but a Massachusetts miracle is. So the 128 loop for those that you don’t know, there’s a loop that goes round Boston called 1:28. That’s route number. And then the day. All the hot computer companies were there, it pre-dates Silicon Valley and literally digital equipment and Wang and all these great companies, and I got hired by a division allied signal at the time to come on out. And he’s great. It was really fascinating how you look at the stuff. So we had a company called Neptune Water Meter Company, which was out of Alabama, made the brass water Meadville. They’re still there. Yeah. Okay. Allied Signal bought them. They found these really smart kids at M.I.T. that said, hey, we can monitor those meters via satellite TV, cable TV, telephone lines, RFID even in the day. This is what this is way back with this. This is in the eighties. Nineteen eighty four and five. Wow. In time orange. I mean this pre-dates all kinds. I was still. You weren’t born your spirit.
[00:20:45] Yeah. I don’t know but I was right there. Yeah. Now I know.
[00:20:50] So. So the crazy thing is is that, you know, I’m like, wow, this is crazy technology. And after working at RadioShack and so on we call them trash, 80 stories, 80 computers. I remember I was really wound out. I’m like, this thing could have some wheels, right? I mean, you know, this is technology wise. It was crazy. So we went and we’re doing this stuff. And unfortunately, after about six or nine months, I can’t remember exactly. I heard the word core competence. And so my boss came to me and said, Tim, I know you came all the way out here from Ohio on houses working out. It’s great if only the rest of the people could learn how to sell this stuff. Right? Because for me, I was selling the heck out of it as well as a guy to California. But nobody else in the company could seem to sell it because you were dealing with municipalities and unions. All right. So I was selling it like, hey, you know, the last time you guys got mugged, the last time that dog bit your guy. You know, you can avoid all that. You can read the stuff. You don’t need to send somebody up in the winter months up into that mountain. Go read those meters. You know, you can do all that. And oh, by the way, he keeps all you people healthy. Rank has grown up in Toledo with unions. I was like, you got me thinking about these guys is powerful.
[00:21:53] Right. But unfortunately, nobody else could figure it out. I tried to be a an entrepreneur. I found a roommate that, as with had some money. His family had money and he introduced it is a good way to start down. It’s a great entry way. But unfortunately, I also learned about big business. So I went to my boss and I said, well, how about a fight you’re gonna get out of the business is what I understand. I’m going to be out of a job, but I believe in this stuff. So I’ll buy the technology. We compare it up to your meters and I’ll just take it over. And they said, yeah, no, we’re not going to sell you the pens or the rights. And I’m like, but you’re you’re out of the business. Why? Why wouldn’t you sell that to me? I’m like, how much more money do you need? What do you what do you think the valuation is? So I brought in a smart finance people that were related to a friend of mine. And basically Allied Signal said, now you don’t understand. We just don’t care. Right. Right. It’s just it’s a rounding error surrounding her. So we’re just gonna park it so we’re not going to sell it to you. Yeah. And I could never understand. To this day, I don’t understand it. How old were you then? I was young. So maybe three, four years out of college. Yeah, right. But it could have been.
[00:22:54] That’s pretty amazing that you’re having these conversations. The way I’m 25 years older.
[00:22:59] But the crazy thing is, is if you look today, all these years later, that’s exactly how this stuff works. Right. You know, it was you know, and so those kids, it M.I.T. were smart as heck. And so what it really taught me was, is it’s it’s not necessarily about the idea. It’s it’s how do you how do you commercialize the idea? Right. And we saw that in my lifetime because I saw it with Steve Jobs and Microsoft. And they basically took a lot of Xerox’s stuff. Right. And merchandised it and packaged it.
[00:23:29] And it’s the execution of the execution of the idea.
[00:23:32] How do you commercialize it and execute on it? So similar to your podcast, the story that you’re telling me? Scott Absolutely. So very, very fun stuff. But that’s how I got into the business. And, you know, got recruited by my buddy. I got tired of what I was doing was between jobs and. And I said, Hey, let me get this. You’re gonna go against u._p._s. Nobody’s ever succeeded against u._p._s. They’re hugely profitable, hugely funded. And you’re gonna do this out this little tiny thing. And I said, that sounds like a fight I want to be part of. Yeah, but I was terrified. Unbeknownst, you know, some like a yo offer me good money. Sounds like a great fight I want to be part of. But I actually drove 120 miles round trip from Boston down to seekonk, Rhode Island, because I wasn’t sure if the company was gonna be around. And I had somebody to. I had a cheap rent, but. So if I got really tired, we roadway was known for having a lot of guys out of the army. So it wasn’t unusual for me to set up a cot, you know. And so I went I really read a lot of the startup stories. You know, these companies in California, I’m like, I did that only I was in trucking.
[00:24:34] Yakking just wasn’t sexy. Yeah, right. It wasn’t for fun or cool, but it was really neat. We weren’t very good at what we did. You’d sign up to three accounts and you’d lose one or two of those every week. You unloaded the trailers, loaded the trailers. So you learned every facet of the business in those early days. So it truly was entrepreneurial. And I still remember when we made it to a billion dollars, which was, you know, the fastest company. And then. Terror to reach a billion dollars, how fast it was Giberson idea. Less than 10 years. I mean, like maybe five or six years. It was fast. Really crazy. Fast going. And then FedEx actually exceeded it. That’s when a billion dollars was a billion. A billion dollars. Right. Big deal. So. And what people really don’t realize is if you if you take the LTL market today. Right. Hundreds. You know, the top 10 companies, once you take off, like the top two or three there, there’s sub billion. They’re all in maybe three, four, five hundred million dollar range. So even in today’s world in transportation, warehousing, there are big companies. So the company I’m with today is a billion, approximately a billion dollars in sales.
[00:25:39] And it’s a real quick. Looks like we’re Segway into the radial story. Right. So just a are we.
[00:25:46] I feel like there’s so much more he could tell us. Well, what would you like to know? To tell you? Can I leave before we do that?
[00:25:52] I got to tell you, your level of introspection over your career is amazing. You’ve got me thinking about things that I realize how shallow I do.
[00:26:02] Well, it’s one of those dots. Right. And from RadioShack to you. Yes. Every everything that goes with it and how little how little.
[00:26:11] I think people kind of internalize that. But the story that you’ve told here is really is really very logical progression.
[00:26:18] But I didn’t know that at the time. At the time it. But you know it. Yes, I do now. And in fact, it was like I said that watch that Apple video of Steve Jobs. And that’s where it all clicked for me. But, you know, if you talk to my mother, you know, she’d say you’ve just been a hot mess. She life. Yeah. You just went off into the wilderness. Well, you know, I went off to college in Bowling Green. So, you know, that was interesting because the reason I went there was there’s three girls for every guy, cause it was a teacher’s college and was cheap. And I was paying my own way through college. I’ve never understood why Bowling Green’s colors are anything but Greene right around in orange is brown and orange and it has a bird. So here’s the funny thing is if you have a brown and orange and it has a bird and I went to Auburn. It’s got a bird. Right. Right. And when it’s got orange in it. So I don’t know something’s going on there. So it keeps being drawn back in that kind of thing.
[00:27:07] So we’ll show it as a wonder you’re not an airfreight. Well, yeah, I mean that FedEx bought us and when I was in airfreight, did heavyweight air freight with FedEx and a lot of other stuff. Yeah. So. Well, thank you for the kind words and introspection and estimating. Always interesting.
[00:27:22] So tell us about radio. Yeah. What? Where were you before radio and. Yeah. Tell us a little bit about that. And I have some history with radio, so I’m really interested. Yeah.
[00:27:32] So so kind of interesting. Spent approximately 30 years at FedEx, mostly on sales. Worked at just about every operating company they had. Took a lot of lateral roles. Was either partnered with or worked for. So I worked for our P.S. then FedEx bottom, you know, became part of a part of that sales group. You know, FedEx bought trade what’s now FedEx Trade Networks. So I helped integrate. I was responsible for that relationship. So was part of FDX, the holding company for a short period of time during the merger. The two companies I did a lot of jobs and I finished off in the global account program. So I helped start that up at FedEx under the leadership of some good folks and went to the international side because even though we were told we large accounts and worldwide we called it, the reality is we weren’t international.
[00:28:20] I’ve never lived anywhere internationally. But that was the closest thing you could get because I went to a ton of countries. FedEx’s in 220 countries and territories. I went to a ton of them. And that’s actually what prepared me for what happened. So I kind of got to the point at FedEx where it’s like, you know, I don’t know what else to do. I’m not a good old friend from Memphis. So I probably wasn’t given feeling there right there. Well, you know, it’s you know, the interesting thing about Memphis and FedEx is, is the reality is, is FedEx is a southern based company. And, you know, to get to the right levels, it helps to be in Memphis. And my wife and I had been living in Boston a long time. She’s a southern Connecticut girl. And we really had no interest in go on to Memphis.
[00:29:03] It’s just Boston and Memphis are a lot alike. Right. Yeah. Part of you is really good. So I convinced my wife to move with me to L.A.. That was hard enough to go to Memphis. It just wasn’t high. Has not gonna. Not gonna happen. We almost moved to Ohio on three different occasions back during the roadway.
[00:29:18] Global air days. Back to Toledo and no Akron. Okay. Akron, Hudson, Ohio, because there was roadway roadways, headquarters was there. So as talked about a job going back to their headquarters at one time, I was talking about Roadway Global Air, which was based there. And then ultimately, Calver Logistics, I did work for what was roadway Logistics became calibur Logistics for a period of time. So we almost moved there. And then I before I signed the papers, I said, you got to sign a piece. Paper says, if we sell this company, then you got to move back to wherever I want and guarantee me a year’s salary. And my boss didn’t do it and refused. And I just said that we are. So all I can say to listeners out there is if your heart’s telling you something. Don, you some better believe it. Let’s listen. Yeah, right. Yeah. So sure enough, on Monday morning, there was announced, you know, FedEx is bought, you know, caliber and oh, by the way, everybody that was in Ohio needed to move to Memphis. So I would have just moved there, then move. Tell my wife now we’re moving. Memphis wouldn’t have gone well. So anyways, went to work there. I was not a good student.
[00:30:20] I was a Sigma Nu and there was a social chairman, if that says anything to you.
[00:30:26] So I had a really good time in college, was not a very good student, certainly not focused, but I had a lot of fun and that’s all I really wanted to be honest with you. So I was paying the bill that worked. And in those days she’s got degrees and nobody really cared. You know. I mean, that was if he graduated college, that was a big deal.
[00:30:43] Brad Jacobs just stopped going and looked. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I wish so. I didn’t know about those stories back then. But anyways, I decided to be a good dad.
[00:30:55] I had a son. And, you know, I could see FedEx was kind of tapan out. I really I thought the end of the runway was there. I’d done just about everything and I knew I could do more. My older son was gonna get ready to go off to college and I said, hey, why don’t I go get an MBA? My wife showed me on a couple jobs average looking at an MBA preferred. And she goes, What are you gonna do if you don’t get the job and they use as a checkbox to delineate you. And I said, Hey, I’ll try to be a role model for my older son. So at the ripe age of 50, I went back taking Auburn because he had a nice balanced program as part on school and part remote. Now, I was traveling the world, so timing worked well. He had all these great schools up in Boston. But, you know, they require you to be there on the weekends or during the night. And I just don’t fit my schedule. So I went back. I graduated with Foro, beat my son. He graduate with honors and did a wonderful job, as much better student I ever was. And I worked really hard. But it was it was good for me because, you know, it it it did it several things. A, it gave me a better appreciation of analytics. And Alex were hot and I didn’t want more Supply chain or Logistics classes, but I loved the analytics and the statistics classes. Going back to your early days and forecasting and planning. Yeah, I could see this is really important for retailers and inventory and things like that. This could be really, really important for us. And then, you know, it’s kind of like getting a tune up, right? You know, how do I take the academia life and and cross compare that. So, you know, it gave me an opportunity to be a good mentor to a lot of the younger students and prepare. Well finished.
[00:32:23] If Miura that different stage in life. So school, it just takes on a new life. I mean, it’s it’s a lot more I mean, I find it this stage of life. I really am passionate about learning and reading and all of that.
[00:32:35] And when I was in college, same I mean, I was I was social chair of it. Weren’t you a linebacker? Well, I was social.
[00:32:43] I played football and then I was social chair of the rugby team after I quit playing football Saturday night. And then Rush, chairman of my fraternity.
[00:32:49] And I I mean, it turned out maybe that’s why we get along. Go why, single guy? You were my big competitor.
[00:32:55] Yeah, let me try it. Yeah, that’s right. That’s right. We’re the Alvear kicked off campus at Brown and I’ve I don’t know. They’re coming. It happened after my stewardship. It’s hard to be in a fraternity in twenty twenty. I think it was hard back then.
[00:33:08] So I remember watching the movie, you know, National Lampoon. And I’m like, yeah, the dean and I were on a personal name basis prior offering. Right.
[00:33:16] I thought it was good times. I heard it was hazing. And I just still didn’t do that. I think is nerves against hazing.
[00:33:21] I didn’t really either when I was there. But I think that the definition of hazing in 2020 might be like, you know, a lot less than what it was in 1996 when I was pledging and I don’t want to get us to destroy you might be me.
[00:33:36] I it’s actually far worse than I ever experienced. It hasn’t been a binge drinking. It’s out of control. It’s like it’s like they’ve regressed. I asked. I think you’re very involved with my fraternity.
[00:33:48] And it it’s like some of the chapters have really regressed.
[00:33:53] And that’s why some people have gotten into really bad situations, unfortunately. Right.
[00:33:57] I mean, they need a kick in the ass. That’s what they need. But they’ll get there. They’ll go. They’re gonna get it, too.
[00:34:01] Yeah. Yeah. I mean, they are going to get back to the show. Scott. All right. Where do they recover and everything?
[00:34:07] So these are foundations for their right or foundation of how you shape your self and your worldview. GREENE All right. So let’s talk about anyway.
[00:34:16] Yeah, I’ll tell you. Well, I’ll tell you how I landed here. Yeah, some great radio got well just before that. So what was funny is so, you know, here I go and get my MBA.
[00:34:25] All right. I finally graduate and well, as on the road, a headhunter from Hasbro Toys calls my wife and says, hey, we know about him. Does Tim know anybody? Yeah. Is anybody take one each course? Does Tim know anybody that could run a global supply chain for Hasbro toys? My wife goes, I don’t know. I’ll call him. So she calls me. And this is what you think I say. I don’t know anybody.
[00:34:46] And she didn’t even realize they were asking about you didn’t even realize it, because for years I had always been one of those guys. It just would pass the names, make the connection. Same thing.
[00:34:55] Do you still do that? There are a hundred jobs these past. Somebody was drunk. So is my wife.
[00:35:02] You know, she goes, I got the jobs back and she says, I really believe this is you. And I went down and interviewed. And it was kind of funny because the guy that interviewed me was a finance guy. And he’s. And and it was a great example of where Fed-Ex was misunderstood. Now, tie back to why this makes less sense. But, you know, he’s like FedEx. Are you guys do envelopes? I do. Ocean containers full of toys from China. What do you know about it? I’m like, well, we have a billion dollar division called FedEx Trade Networks. He’s like, oh, I didn’t know that. Right. And so the story went on. Well, needless to say, they hired me. I built a big global shared services organization, modeled it off. A lot of what we did at FedEx from building that shared services organization that we had at FedEx took. What I learned is FedEx was very, very good at Supply chain. They just didn’t know how good they were and they weren’t good at transferring that information to the clients. So I was able to do really good job there. And then I got hired by a company to help me take a company public down here, that job. We were able to do it much, much faster in less than six months, which is kind of incredible if you think about it. And then ironically, I got a similar call from the folks up at radio and unbeknownst to them, I had gotten called by Sterling when Sterling and take over Hurley. Yeah. And I’d said, I’m not interested because I know how P companies work. By the way, I just worked for one. Yeah, it was great. You know, for my pocketbook. But it’s not a place I really want to invest a lot of time in long term because it’s it’s really there is no long term isn’t a long term.
[00:36:27] And you know, I’m getting to the point my career where I’m just not that cutthroat. I’m actually a decent guy most of the time maybe. How can you doubt? I vouch for it. All right. That’s all I got for so radial called. And I had a few other job offers.
[00:36:41] But I said, let me get this. So this Belgian company has bought this company since then. You’re gonna put a lot of money into it. You’re gonna think long term. You’re actually going to become very, very customer centric, which is really the founding principles of FedEx. If you think about people service profit. And you’re gonna do this saying. And I said, oh, my gosh, this reminds me of our P.S. all those years ago where we can take this little tiny thing that nobody really understands and grow it into a multi-billion dollar business because everything’s on our side.
[00:37:10] You know, everybody hates Amazon. I love your ACA, right? Yeah. Anybody but Amazon. And so nobody really cares for them. The retailers in particular. The space is growing. The demographics are growing. And it’s really a complex business. So, you know what was left when I joined? Is everything but the front end, unfortunately, is a little. We had the front end at the time, right? Sorry, Bay. Three bay. It’s now called Magento. They didn’t quite get it right, but that Shopify company did. Yeah. I don’t know what their valuation is these days. Apart by FedEx. Millions. Yes, tens of billions from less than I look. But so anyways, we’ve got everything from click to door. So very compelling. And we’ve been turning this story around since I’ve been there and has been super exciting. Your rocket ship ride in last year and a half, that a bender, some real blast.
[00:38:01] It’s interesting because I’ve not that I did business with with radio at the time, but they went through the progression of being eBay enterprises. It was a front end and and a fulfillment engine. Then they split it off like you’re talking about, made it Magento Adobe, bought it.
[00:38:19] And if it wasn’t bad enough before Adobe. That’s right. So it’s virtually disappeared. But but radial provides that. And you know, this this anyone but Amazon, it’s not just hate speech. All right. No, I think there is a legitimate. You know, my argument there is there is a legitimate space in the marketplace for those companies that provide the facilities and the capabilities that Amazon provides today. Yes, because companies want the independence. Right. They want to. They don’t want competition from their platform provider. And and they don’t want this race to the bottom of pricing. That’s why you see Nike and IKEA and various brands flooding away. And they want to they want the relationship with the consumer. Yeah, right. They don’t want to be, you know, cut away. They don’t want to be a Logistics and supply chain. But they aren’t.
[00:39:06] But they really, really, really are focused on where the growth is. And, you know, it’s interesting for, you know, you guys have been around this retail space in the word retail apocalypse for the last year and a half has just been everywhere. Right. Yeah. And and I would say that’s just the wrong way. And we just had pure one’s announcement. Yeah. Bankruptcy. Right. Just another of many. Yeah. But I would also say it’s. And what people don’t seem to get is it’s actually retail renaissance. Right. So if you if you have good understanding of retail consumers, consumerism is bigger and better than ever before. We’re more global than ever before.
[00:39:43] Yeah. And so that creates a massive wave of opportunities for companies.
[00:39:49] So we sat down with John Gold at in Vegas at the Reverse Logistics Association next digital and just supply chain it. John is he was our. He’s our. lead-off interview, I believe, and he yes, about five in the morning.
[00:40:02] That’s exactly. I’m sorry. What made the retail Parklea promise not to do that to you? Thank you. Did you know all night in Vegas? Did not that not that night? No.
[00:40:14] But read retail apoc apocalypse is cliche if you look at the revenue numbers. The last couple years, a really strong especially. Look. Look at him over the last 10. And compare and contrast. And to your point, naturally, like every other sector. That’s right. That’s dealing with disruption. The models are going to evolve. And just like consumers, it will I mean, stating the obvious. E-commerce is, what, 25 percent of owners of all you said of all. Yep. Of course, the retailers adjust what they need to serve and grow their revenue, right? That’s right. So it’s not necessarily a.
[00:40:48] Let me chime in here, please.
[00:40:50] But if Pier 1 is there, based in DFW, there you should see their distribution center middle of nowhere.
[00:40:58] And they get an lot of it’s obviously.
[00:41:01] But I mean, like they have they had a they had obsolete supply chain Toys R US, obsolete supply chain. Go look who’s here, civilities.
[00:41:10] When they here literally invented mail order retail. It’s a direct catalog retail. They own it, which is a centrally wastebook, which is essentially a physical like version of of e-commerce. It is. Right. Yeah, absolutely. It’s more about perspective. It’s more about, you know, so many these companies are protecting their old business models to the to the death, literally to the day and night.
[00:41:32] And they in their fear of it. I mean, when the model used to be to go get free land in the middle of nowhere, given to you by the government and build a building at low to no cost write vs. go find land close to the big city centers and spend it to demand and then buy a million and fifty million dollars to go set up a new dis DC next to the rooftops. And that to make that decision. It’s obviously extremely hard. But then you look at Best Buy and they’re crushing it. And why? Because they’re ahead of this. And they saw it coming in.
[00:42:07] Well, they got crushed early. It did. I mean, they got crushed early and they’ve recovered. They really recovered and adapted. Yeah.
[00:42:13] And in so much of that, I think has to do with their distribution infrastructure. And in just trying to follow the demand that’s going along with e-commerce and in the retailers that are doing that and paying attention to it are I think are out there crushing it right now. And they’re either some will do it on their own. But the bulk of them are hiring three peoples to go specialize in the supply chain right here.
[00:42:41] That’s Tim. I mean, that’s at or you’re at on why the future is bright for companies like radio because radials far more than a three P.l. Not to explain your company for you, but what?
[00:42:50] Haven’t had some history there. I mean basically once the button is click to buy now. Yes, we radio taking care of every single thing. Yeah, right. And right. So if you if you want instant, instantaneous capability to to, you know, participate in e-commerce, you just throw a Web site up and and you guys take care of the rest. Is that. I mean that’s that’s a..
[00:43:13] Fair as it’s a fact. So so radial. I mean just give you some statistics know which all made most of the listeners. Yeah. So radial process is $6.5 billion a year in credit card transactions online. Most people don’t even know we’re in that space. Right. So we’re a fintech right in rights terms. Then we have thirty eight hundred call center seats right where we take the calls. Where’s my order? What’s going on? Right. And support of the brands. All right. And we do that for a ton of companies. Then you’ve got the fulfillment centers that Ward talked about. So we’ve got twenty one of those in are all multi-tenant.
[00:43:48] One thing that makes us a bit different is we believe that product lines go up and down and that you win in this space by multi-tenancy. Right? Right. So it’s fractional ownership, which ironically we’ve been in for a long time. And yeah, people are going home. That’s cool. And let it create a great I haven’t thought of that been around a long time. And then we can do the final mile, whether that’s U.P.S., FedEx or the lazers, the on traction so we can provide that on a national and or a international basis through other landmark global division. Now that’s the infrastructure and the people think of us as the fulfillment. We do all that. What people really don’t know is beyond that, we actually have a distributed order management system, right, called radial order management. Real innovative. I’ve got work with my marketing team to come up really good. But it’s really good. It’s. So here’s the crazy thing is, since I’ve gotten there, we we went to the industry experts, we went to Gartner, Forrester, IDC said put this thing to the test and I want to know where we rank. So for those of you out there that are familiar with the waves and the other reports of these analysts, do these analysts are hard? I mean, they know they’re the benchmark in the best. Right. And the ironic thing is, is our order management system came out with the best analytic. And the best reporting, better than IBM, better the Manhattan, better than Oracle in a lot of people don’t know I’m my own I.T. shop, so that’s my code. We develop it ourselves. We’ve got our own India Development Center, as well as U.S. developers.
[00:45:11] And what makes us unique and different, my mind is operators. As operators, we now take all those insights from those 200 core brands that we manage, take those insights, embed that in. So we’re constantly looking at it from an operator and a software provider viewpoint versus just the software house. Right. So we put 10 million dollars in investment into the software side of the house just for order management system and another 2.5 into our dropship software. So we were the first in the market with the protocol vendor net and we bought that company Internet store net. Yeah, that software hasn’t been updated in years. It’s still the backbone. So if you go to DSW today and you buy a pair of shoes online, pick up in store. That’s actually our engine that’s running that verso, whether it’s BOPE s or Borris or, you know, all those types of things where the engine Patel people.
[00:45:58] What that is. Yes. And got a bonus buy online, especially me. Tell me what you’re talking about. So Vocus is buy online and you get all of these acronyms.
[00:46:06] All right. Buy online pickup in-store. Boris’s buy online. Return in-store. Yeah, right. You can buy online ship from store. Right. And that’s a big, big deal. So. So a lot of people don’t understand why would we want to do that? We’re a fulfillment center. I’ll give you a great example. There’s a retailer down here in the south part of the country may have heard of. It’s called Steinmetz out of Jackson, of course. So so Steinmark, old school retailer. Been around a long time. And a lot of stores there in the discount space. You know, a little higher end discount. Nice customer service. And so we’ve been doing their e-commerce for a long, long time. So we do all those services. We just talked about lots and lots of services form, but we weren’t doing and they were fighting. Well, why would we want to ship from store? Why would we want to do that? Right. That doesn’t make any sense. So we finally, you know, worked in partnership with them. What I can tell you is, is to your point, walk the time from click to door or click to available is now been significantly increased. And our orders with them through that electronic platform are screaming fast.
[00:47:11] And the space requirements are going down. People go, Yeah. Is it good for you, Tim? And I would say, yeah, because I can back sell that space. And it’s already built out for e-commerce. Doesn’t need huge CapEx and we’re getting those electronic transactions. So we’re enabling our partners to be more responsive to their customers, better compete with what’s going on there in the marketplace. You know, and the better part is on a pure e-commerce shipment. And when you sell it, it is what it is. Buy online pickup in store. You’re getting anywhere from a 15 to maybe a 25 percent lift on cross-sell opportunity. So it’s a big deal.
[00:47:43] So that’s why these people are loving this in generating this value for your customer. Then you can go tell that story and get more customers. And yeah, there’s some parallels. What I do there in that if we go figure out that somebody is and say three hundred thousand square feet and maybe 24 foot clear, we go put him in a 36 foot clear building and to size them down and then they’re saving that money on per square foot costs.
[00:48:09] And people are like I mean, a lot of people that are skeptical about having a great real estate provider say, why would you do that? You’re cutting your paycheck in half. No, I’m going to go have a story to tell. That’s going to hopefully 10 x my customer base because of that. And then I’m doing 10x transactions in who? I want to be downsizing them and cutting their costs. And it’s going to all pay off right now.
[00:48:34] So the demographics are all there. And ironically, one of the hottest areas we’re seeing is is pop UPS for peak season or specials or influencer. Right. Right. So you have a you know, as much as the market has been hot, there’s also a lot of retail space that’s been vacated. Right. Yes. Okay. Of a variety of different sites. Last mile space. So smile space. Yes. So if you want the ability to say I’m going to have a social influencer showing up in Manhattan in two weeks and I want, you know, and they’re going to hit Instagram and I’m pretty gonna do one hundred thousand orders and, you know, instantaneously and they’re gonna want that stuff like now. Right. Well, we can do that. So we partner with somebody like Ward. Right. Find that space available for a very short time. Might be only four weeks or so. Yeah. Right. Pop that up. We can drop the orders and direct those orders to that zip code to that location with those items. You got to know your inventory and we have all the tools to do that. Right. Our order management system helps us manage that. It all links in and then we can meet that same day. Next, a demand curve. So we’re seeing that. And and that’s for what I’m calling emerging brands. You’re also seeing companies like UNTUK It, you know, a company that started off as pure eCom native client. Right. They’ve learned through analysts and these companies, these emerging companies are really, really smart. All right. They got all these young kids who understand analytics and data better than anybody, you know, in the past.
[00:49:58] They’ve built the company based on new technology. It’s all of that legacy.
[00:50:02] They want your. They just drop shipping initially or how down.
[00:50:05] Ok, so untuk it worked with us and right.
[00:50:08] And other companies before us, but now they work with us to do their distribution. But what was funny is, is they did put up a store and when they put up the store, what they found out was sales within that geographic proximity east or rose for their e-commerce orders. So at last count I saw was they were around 80 in the United States. They’re gonna grow. They just opened up stores in Europe.
[00:50:29] So we’re working with them over there as well. So this ability to to work with these emerging brands and ride their coattails up to great success as us being their enabler, that is a really powerful message. And it doesn’t take a lot to get in this business. Like you said, you can get into this business with not a lot of knowledge. You know, if what the Shopify account, you can partner up with sourcing companies in the supply chain to help you source your product. If you’re not sure if you just got an idea, you got a I don’t know what that is. Is that a what is that cargo?
[00:51:00] That’s a cart. Yes. It looks like a low clothing brand. I can say it looks like cotton to me from my Oklahoma. That’s why I wasn’t sure. I don’t know if his that or an oak tree or something, but I don’t I don’t know. But my point is, is the Cotton Bowl does exist.
[00:51:14] So I don’t if you guys remembered I was just laughters, a little brand, yellow snow man on. I go golfing with these guys and I’m like, yeah, I got an eight. I was in a trap. And, you know, down in Florida, I got my desert. Good name. So so there is an opportunity for these emerging brands to partner with relics of Radil or Words Company and Collier’s or others or like Salt Box where we’re at today. You know, to say, hey, how do I go into a shared services type environment? Multi-client type of environment. Get the scale, professionalism, business acumen of those companies and write my company up or where I want to do it versus trying to build all that infrastructure and overhead and ourselves.
[00:51:51] So we get a Segway a little bit because I want to move more broadly. Sure. All right. Alan and Danny, get your insights on the industry.
[00:52:00] By the way, can I point out that Scott is the master of the Segway in steering these companies? Yes. The traffic they get first clue. This would be a four hour. Yes. I think some white gloves and some kicked me out. So I’m feeling very well.
[00:52:16] There’s some. I mean, I go back to Greg’s earlier point. There’s so much that you’ve brought up that we could dove deep on both do it on a future show. Yes.
[00:52:25] We’re gonna kick off a series, a Tim Hinkley’s series and win a chapter about chapter, right? Yeah. OK. I’ll see if anybody lets e-commerce Logistics. We’ll have to. We’ll have to get him while he’s in town. I’m here a lot. That’s good. That’s good. The winner. Yeah. And the winner for sure.
[00:52:40] So if you if you go broader. Yes. Clearly, we’ve talked a lot of insights from retail and e-commerce. And some Logistics and Phil fulfillments. Supply chain mohanned that. But if you go broader and think of the global India in Supply chain universe right now, you know what else that may or may not be related to radio that really jumps off the page, jumps off the news stories, it jumps off your email or social media. It’s really between your ears right now.
[00:53:08] Wow. That’s kind of broad, but I’ll I’ll take it wherever you’d like. All right. I’ll I’ll reflect because there’s some key events that are going on right now. So in a few weeks, for those of since you say global, I’m going to start back at the sourcing side of. OK. Part of my life, I get to live at Hasbro. So with China situation on the virus, it’s disrupting things. We just saw something in The Wall Street Journal today with Apple saying they’re going to miss their numbers because of that. And so I’m not sure if people understand sourcing implications of supply chain implications. So as companies were migrating to other sourcing points, China is still a heck of a powerhouse and a ton of product coming out of there.
[00:53:47] There’s no there’s no place in the world that can absorb. But they’ve already I saw it last night, a discussion, Wall Street Journal also where they’re saying no matter where you go, there is not enough capacity in all of the comparison places, Southeast Asia, South America, wherever to make up for the crash.
[00:54:06] And on that point, you know, we’ve had a series of conversations this this week. Of course, Ross, Wall Street Journal did a lot of great reporting, resilience, 360s and a lot of great reporting. And the sense I’m getting from a lot of these conversations is that folks think we’ve already been hit. Now, let’s see perspective now. It is it is a tidal wave coming in.
[00:54:27] And I think that’s the closest thing we’ve had to this is in the automotive industry. If you go back a few years, there was a disruption in Japan. Right. And it was the tier two and three suppliers that just completely fractured the industry. Right. And what I can tell you is I’ve been part of many dialogs and committees on this type of stuff. And very, very, very few companies are capable of building that type of resiliency and still hitting the costs and the time the market requirements they need. Yeah, but it’s stuff like this is going to force. Pennies to reflect so well, we’re a long way from resolution. We’re a long way from resolution. Absolutely. So then that leads into the second aspect. So I’ll put some a good word in for another good friend of mine’s. So there’s another company called New York Shipping Exchange.
[00:55:13] There’s a good friend of mine. It’s a part of that organization. But when I was in that ocean business, what I found interesting is blank sailing’s. Right, so that the ships would be there. They’d blank out. You wouldn’t pick your stuff up. They would not load you, things like that.
[00:55:28] And unfortunately, if you miss it, you know, it could have serious implications. Yep. So he came up with the concept. Then how do you create a liquefied market for futures on ocean contracts? Now seems kind of innocuous, but for a guy like me at the time I was like, you know, we’re running a production line for toys for particular holiday. Well, we test things. Well, maybe there’s a production glitch that DI wasn’t the right color. You know, it’s something that come out. Raw materials didn’t get there in time. So all those containers that I had planned to book, you know, now I have no use for those things. Right. And I’ve got a commitment to my ocean carrier and I’m standin naked, basically. Right. And if it didn’t have a really good relationship with those carriers in charge anyway, they charge anyways.
[00:56:11] They call that getting ghosted. Yeah. 2020, right? That’s right.
[00:56:14] So. So he came up with an idea and said, hey, you know, I’ll build this company and people can buy futures contracts and there’s guarantees and oh, by the way, if you can’t use them, you can sell em for whatever the market value is at that point in time. Weight container timeshares. Yeah. Well. So it could be higher or lower. But the point is you could budget. So for me when I was with Hasbro I really linked into this and I said, hey, I see more volatility, not stability with the compression of the ocean liners coming together. So there used to be a lot more. Um, there’s fewer of them. Yeah. You know, and ironically, the loads and the imbalances remain the same. There’s a lot of irrationalities in that market. So it’s another area on that aspect where technology and disruption is happening. And there’s another company that’s in the freight forwarding space. It’s up in the northwest and they’re doing it on the three P.l. Fording market. Okay. So what I would say is technology is the core enabler of all this business problems or continue to be what they are. Yeah. And is really, really bright times to be in the supply chain space. If you can pair up what you did, Greg, in your past, pair that technology to a true business problem in the sky’s the limit.
[00:57:29] Yeah. Yeah, right. The idea that only a few people are going to own the market is absolutely incorrect. There’s disruption that’s going to continue to happen. It’s happened for generations as it should, as it should. And you know, the agile companies, the ones that embrace this stuff, the ones that acknowledge it will do well. So if you look at FedEx right now, they’re in a world of hurt. Yeah. For I don’t know how many 10K calls I got on four years. They would say Amazon is not a competitor. You know, earlier this year they announced our last year actually was they announced, oh, well, maybe we now see the missing abettor and luckily they didn’t get in to do deals with them. UBS is doubling down with them. I believe that to be a big mistake. I think, you know, they’re they’re creating their biggest enemy and FedEx, this place, you know, faced with some serious challenges. And I just read on the news this morning, Wal-Mart’s also facing softer sales. So I’m looking to see, Ken, some of these giants pair together. Yeah. And partner up in a more meaningful supply chain way.
[00:58:25] I think Amazon’s known throughout the industry also for partnering with folks and then in figuring out what they do and then doing it themselves.
[00:58:33] Well, Amazon’s been doing that for a long time in real truth, because in 2014, FedEx and U.P.S. failed them during peak season, as Kyra. And that’s when they decided they would build their own network and they used their A.W. as model. That’s right. So they they they needed all this capacity of servers to sell books and then other retail, and then they had all this excess capacity. So they sold that off and they’re doing the exact same thing. So my last company, that’s what we did. We help them build their 200 new fulfillment centers. They build a year right now. And and they’ve built it intentionally, built excess capacity into these facilities so that they can compete. And at first, it was to save themselves from the inability of FedEx and U.P.S. to fulfill their needs. But now they’ve seen the opportunity. Some years ago, I said, well, let’s say it frequently in in a few years. I don’t know how many years. One of those three will no longer be in the Logistics. Well, I’m going to put it out there. I think it’s FedEx. So I do, too. All right. I think FedEx don’t tell Kathy Robertson that. By the way, Ali Moore, who she she’s an analyst, big FedEx fan of the show. And she can make a great argument as to why not why FedEx is not actually we she and I had that put me in a room with her all day long.
[00:59:53] So what I would say is, is FedEx is perfectly positioned. For a merger and or an acquisition with a handful of companies that could greatly benefit, you know, from from that environment with German Fry earlier, I think Wal-Mart of Walmart FedEx combination would be highly productive. People don’t. Outside the United States, most people have no idea how big Wal-Mart is. They have a huge international footprint. Yes. If you just look at basic earnings of FedEx and you assume that that’s now a cost basis, Wal-Mart has a huge trucking fleet. Food delivery. There is food delivery there. End of it. So if you look at the express network, the express network could be in the food delivery business with some minor gyrations. You’d have to change out the truck configurations.
[01:00:35] But FedEx has yet another recruiter called him. So I could feel it, but I’m happy where I am.
[01:00:41] Wal-mart’s got all these store infrastructure, too, that you’re talking about to handle all the fulfillment by store models.
[01:00:46] And I mean, they’re the two would come together quite nice. Yeah.
[01:00:51] So let’s.
[01:00:52] So that’s a. That’s a well that’s a couple of big. Yeah. Coming attractions. I agree. And I think those are really valid insights. We’re hearing more and more, Tim, about the woes at FedEx and and frankly management’s refusal to acknowledge them as a as a significant impact on the company. And that’s always dangerous. That’s the way you wind up being Toys R US or Macy’s or Sears. Right.
[01:01:18] Yes. I mean, you know, for for my take of it is this look, you know, radios a little baby company. I mean, we’re a billion dollar company by many company standards. That’s a big company. But if you look at the space we’re in, we’re dominated by u._p._s. Right. FedEx, DHL, Amazon. Right. There’s there’s a handful of companies that their market caps and their sales are absolutely outstanding. Right. So I think the advantage here is, is and why we’re doing so well is is a lot of companies are saying, how do we partner with somebody that actually cares about us and values our business and wants to be a trusted adviser and not a transaction. Right.
[01:01:54] And you’re a hedgehog, too. I mean, look, if you go to FedEx, they might have a service like radio, right. But they don’t focus on a service like radio. You could literally start. And I intend to because my favorite brand close has gone away. Oh, no. Toys R US.
[01:02:10] Yes. Yes. OK. We’ll help you find another brand. I feel with a lot of them. Right?
[01:02:16] Well, I you know, you could literally set up your brand and that’s where retail is going. They are brand and marketing expert. That is it. And then have have the Logistics every aspect of the Logistics. I was glad to hear you guys do returns as well. So heed every aspect of the Logistics handled from that point forward and you focus on enabling those brands.
[01:02:35] And I’ll just say one more overarching theme here that goes along with not admitting when something’s wrong. Nobody is going to go to the next level and to and succeed by winning. You succeed by losing, acknowledging the failure and learning from the failure and adjusting and going ahead. But if you just say we win, we’re the best, we win, we’re the best. You’re going to be in trouble because you I mean, and Jeff Bezos is known for its very constant and never ending improvement in their systems. And that’s there. He’s never going to just say, OK, we’re on top. He’s right. Their spin, they’re investing billions of dollars into figuring out how to stay on top and learn from their mistakes and acknowledging those mistakes.
[01:03:17] Good point. All right. So, Tim, I want to give make sure our audience knows as much as we want a book on a second hour to the show today and dove into some even deeper. How can our audience learn more about radio and connect with you?
[01:03:31] Yeah. They’re going to want to. I appreciate that. So very simple. It’s radial dicom or ADIZ. AL.com is our Web site. All of our services are listed on out there. We’re gonna be out at the shoptalk show. So for those of you that are gonna be out there, we’d be more than happy to see at our booth myself and our head of client success. We’ll be down at RELA just on a personal basis floating around. You can reach me at T Hinkley, HIMSS, Kaili Y at radio dot com again real simple t Hinkley at radio dot com easy elfrida to get a hold of me.
[01:04:03] Awesome. Well, we’ll have you back as 10/20 continues to unwrap that rotten Ravell evolve.
[01:04:09] Just real quick. Yeah. To connect you with Cindy Lago love. That’s at shoptalk. So let me talk about that.
[01:04:14] And one more thing. We need to bring Tim bag and we need to focus in and maybe maybe even get it Brad in here. And that makes sense. And talk about this fulfillment strategy and your 21 fulfillment centers and how you’re growing, how it’s impacted by the labor market because this is a real estate show.
[01:04:31] Yeah. We didn’t talk to we didn’t talk too much about real estate. Own that. So net.
[01:04:36] Yeah. Or I like not to put you on the spot, but to put you on the spot if you had just a couple of observations or predictions for 2020. Yeah. Kind of what you’re seeing, what your team. Tim seeing Dale u.s.-made. Yeah. Just a couple of bold, fearless predictions. And you you’ll have to get too too bold. But what what are you predicting?
[01:04:56] Well, the. My last prediction at the end of last year was to look for a little bit of constraint in major CapEx expenditures as it’s going on with.
[01:05:08] Yeah, there’s there’s some major constraints in people while there. I mean, if people are going to be making big changes, it’s because they’re being forced to make them and they just have to. But if they have the option to delay, I think a combo of the penina election and the impacts of that could have whichever direction it goes. And then not all. I mean, pre pre carone a corona virus in the trade. The trade agreement, only phase one has been done. Now, I understand the Corona virus is going to be impacting China’s ability to live up to this pact to begin with. And so even though we have phase one done, I don’t know if they’re going to be able to handle it because of this new crisis. And so what’s happening with that and how that how that’s impacting that’s a whole nother thing. I’d love to hear your your view on Tim and just how how these retailers that are sourcing from China are being impacted, because I’ve talked about it a lot in that the combo of those two things and the fact that we’re in the midst of the longest bull market in the history of the United States and that things are cyclical and it doesn’t stay like this. And if you look at the e-commerce growth pattern, it is so consistent and it keeps going up.
[01:06:22] There you go right there. And then he does look at it. And I mean, I think it is still in its infancy. So that’s great for everybody in the room.
[01:06:32] And but still, it’s been a long run. Yeah. And that I think people are are a little nervous. So real estate wise, they’re built. They’ve been building more product than ever. They’ve been absorbing more product than ever with. I mean, I’m speaking about Industrial real estate specifically. This is all really being driven by e-commerce. And will that continue? Let’s hope so. And I think it will. But I think developers are every everybody is paying close attention to what’s going on in the supply and demand in the marketplace. So I think there’s just a lot of conservative. You know, they’re being cautiously optimistic that, yes, that’s the term.
[01:07:14] All right. So we know how to follow with Tim in radio. Ward, how can folks reach out to you and keep, you know, picking your brains on this thing?
[01:07:22] Yeah. So I have my blog is Supply chain real estate dot com, which I love, by the way. Thank you. I love it. I built that a couple of years ago. We actually just revamped it. So we redesigned it.
[01:07:36] I have a great web designer that I work with and we he he recommended that we do make some tweaks to get the speed up. We have a lot of content on there and logo, too.
[01:07:47] Yeah, I got a great logo thanks to Scott’s suggestion, Scott. Scott nicely told me he didn’t like my old logo. Wow. If Scott doesn’t like it, that’s telling you something. Let’s give a plug for the company that you guys got. He’s got marketing props. I like it.
[01:08:01] What is the logo? Attorney logos. Logo. Hurley. Yeah, dot com. And I crowd-sourcing, as I recall, no logo. And you know, you get all these different designers that throw ideas at you and I pay I think a couple hundred bucks and we got a really cool new logo and or I need a new yeti.
[01:08:20] Yeah, I need to order some more yetis and but my cell phone’s always the best. You text me to 1 4 3 3 6 5 7 5 7. Boy scares me when you buy. Always love it. Just text me. And I mean, if you could see the I. Tim and I text the day I text and not give my number out. Please don’t worry. I’m not. I don’t want anyone else to have me. Well, all right.
[01:08:47] This is just the start of our programing here in twenty. We got a ton of feedback. Or even though we don’t always talk about real estate, we’ve got a ton of feedback on the series between the guests like Tim to your own going insights and feedback and and hot take on what’s going on. So we love it. This is such a great start for 2020. And we look forward to having you back in Atlanta.
[01:09:09] Yeah, well, I’m hoping we get really well then this year. That’s a little. So we get at least one a month. Absolutely. It’s my pleasure to be here. And I I love coming out to Supply chain City. It’s it’s like my home away from home better when you’re in this industry there. There’s so much going on here in Atlanta. Yeah. And yeah, it’s such an exciting place to be agreed. And I’ll be back for the Atlanta Supply chain Award. Right. Martin, meet up March 10th. Is Madox going on?
[01:09:34] That’s coming up as well as the backdrop. That’s the little show tied to the Atlanta spy. Yeah, but that’s going on the same day as right through the arch. March 9th to 11:00. I’ll be here hanging out with you guys. We’re out. Well, I’ll make sure to have some comfy chairs for you. That’s right. So you ever sit down? This is great. Yeah. Yeah.
[01:09:53] Big thanks to Tim Hinkley. Yeah. Chief. Marshall officer with radio. Big thanks for Ward Richmond, ExactTarget him. BP shareholder at Colliers International. Greg, real briefly to our audience. Be sure to check out events and webinars. We got some great in-person and virtual Vince coming up. Partners around the world. If T Reuters Events. Automotive Industry Action Group. The George Logistics Summit. DHL Resilience 360 mutex X. As you mentioned, of course, Singleton Supply chain Awards, you name it. And of course, the ticket. They can’t find what they’re looking for on that Web site. They can reach out to Arsinoe. Other their S.O know they can reach out. Art CMO Amanda at Supply Chain Now Radio RT.com or it is on Twitter. Greg and I and the organizations all very active on Twitter. Mine is at Scott W Luton and aggregor. Yes. White. Yes. So one final. One final and catch and succinct in Reader’s Digest as we start to close before any Keith thought for the. Yeah, you’re gonna let me tell. Yeah man. Absolutely.
[01:10:57] Well look, I think I’m a big fan of radio. I’ve known them for some years, did some work with them at Blue Ridge when I was running that company. And I love this space. Look, companies need alternatives from the big, big players from not only Amazon, but they need companies that are focused in this industry.
[01:11:18] Like I said earlier, I see retailers becoming more of what they should have been all along and were in the old days, which is brand and marketing experts. And then they can just they can just hand off the other aspects of the business design company.
[01:11:34] Cool sweaters like this from America. I was commenting on earlier. That’s their business. It is their business. Ryder should not be in, especially with e-commerce. Sheer. Right. And we talk about specialization on this show every time I’m here. Right. And that’s the key. Yes. Reed Right. No, no, no, no, no. That’s good. Right. Reed Good to great. Yeah, right.
[01:11:54] I have guys are a hedgehog. You do one thing. You do it better than anyone else in the world, right? And you make your money doing it.
[01:12:00] So that’s I think that’s a lesson from Greg White. I think love that we got start doing that anyway.
[01:12:05] Everyone at this table does the same thing. If you think about it, we’re we’re all specialists. We’re all hedgehogs in our space. Yes.
[01:12:13] That’s Punxsutawney Phil is up for you. Yeah. Yeah. I love that Groundhog Day reference. Get them in woodchucks. I love that that movie never gets old. I know that.
[01:12:24] All right. So big. Thanks again. Ward Richman, Tim Inkley, Greg White to our audience. Be sure to check out other upcoming events, replays of our interviews, other resources at Supply Chain Now Radio dot com. Find us on where we get your podcast from, including you. Be sure to subscribe as we’re rolling out new subscriber rewards programs soon. So on behalf of the entire team here, Scott Luton, wish you a wonderful week ahead and we’ll see you next time on supply chain. Thanks everybody.
Tim Hinckley is executive vice president and chief commercial officer of Radial. He leads the client-success, marketing, sales and strategic-partnership teams, managing Radial customer satisfaction and loyalty. Before joining Radial, Tim held the position of senior vice president of global logistics at Hasbro, where he was responsible for distribution, transportation, warehousing and global trade compliance. He also spent three decades at FedEx, where he was managing director of global accounts. Tim holds an MBA degree from Auburn University and BS degree in marketing from Bowling Green State University.
Ward Richmond is an Executive Vice President and shareholder at Colliers International (NASDAQ: CIGI). His team within Colliers specializes in working with C-level executives and operational specialists to develop and execute corporate real estate strategies on a local and global basis in an effort to maximize operational efficiencies and value. Ward’s primary focus is representing dominant logistics companies in the acquisition and disposition of “supply chain real estate”: distribution centers, truck terminals, last mile hubs, manufacturing facilities and industrial land. With over 12 years of experience, Ward has developed an unparalleled understanding of Supply Chain Real Estate strategy via negotiating 500+ transactions, globally, in 50+ cities while generating millions in value for his customers. Ward enjoys reading, writing and speaking about eCommerce and the logistics industry. He’s been featured on podcasts like the GaryVee Audio Experience and interviewed by multiple publications including The Wall Street Journal. Ward has also been a featured speaker at multiple real estate and logistics conferences around the globe. Ward currently serves on the steering committee for the Colliers International Logistics & Transportation Solutions Group and is an active member of IWLA, IAMC, and the semi-legendary, Texas Warehouse Association. Be sure to check out Ward’s blog at: www.SupplyChainRealEstate.com and learn more about Colliers International here: https://www2.colliers.com/en
Greg White serves as Principle & Host at Supply Chain Now Radio. Greg is a founder, CEO, board director and advisor in B2B technology with multiple successful exits. He recently joined Trefoil Advisory as a Partner to further their vision of stronger companies by delivering practical solutions to the highest-stakes challenges. Prior to Trefoil, Greg served as CEO at Curo, a field service management solution most notably used by Amazon to direct their fulfillment center deployment workforce. Greg is most known for founding Blue Ridge Solutions and served as President & CEO for the Gartner Magic Quadrant Leader of cloud-native supply chain applications that balance inventory with customer demand. Greg has also held leadership roles with Servigistics, and E3 Corporation, where he pioneered their cloud supply chain offering in 1998. In addition to his work at Supply Chain Now Radio and Trefoil, rapidly-growing companies leverage Greg as an independent board director and advisor for his experience building disruptive B2B technology and supply chain companies widely recognized as industry leaders. He’s an insightful visionary who helps companies rapidly align vision, team, market, messaging, product, and intellectual property to accelerate value creation. Greg guides founders, investors and leadership teams to create breakthroughs that gain market exposure and momentum, and increase company esteem and valuation. Learn more about Trefoil Advisory: www.trefoiladvisory.com
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